Salena Mulliken: From Auditor, to CFO, and now Business Owner | EP 19

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Don't be afraid to try something
new.

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You actually learn a ton of new
things and different things than

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they teach you in.
Just because you're not growing

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doesn't mean you're dying.
It may mean you're preparing.

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So there's a lot more basically
just intercompany politics that

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you're dealing with.
If you know accounting, you know

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business.
Data is very important for

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making good decisions in
business.

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That was my first introduction
to a total cash flow disaster.

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Really makes my heart sing when
the light bulbs start going off

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for people.
Growing a small to mid sized

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business is like pushing a stop
train.

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You're going to need help to get
that initial momentum going.

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Administrative tasks like
payroll, managing health

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insurance and HR operations only
add unnecessary weight to your

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already busy schedule.
That's why I'd choose Questco.

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They take care of all the behind
the scenes administrative and HR

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work, letting you focus on what
truly matters, growing your

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business.
Questco is your trusted

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outsourcing HR service provider
to help you get that train

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moving.
That's QUESTCO.

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Questco.
Visit questco.net or call your

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local Quest Co Representative
Thomas Owens at 864-477-0843 to

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get started today.
Well, Selena, thank you so much

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for joining us today.
Today, we are joined by Selena

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Mullikin.
She's a seasoned CPA with a

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wealth of experience in finance
and accounting.

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Over the course of her
impressive career, she's held

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just about every role in the
accounting world, from auditor

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to Chief Financial officer and
now entrepreneur.

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Selena recently launched the
Sage Perspective, a venture that

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leverages her deep expertise to
help businesses gain clarity

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around cash flow and unlock real
growth.

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Selena, thank you so much for
joining us.

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Well.
Thank you for having.

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Me, yeah, absolutely.
It was cool to look over your

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LinkedIn and see that you
started as an auditor and did

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make it all the way to CFO role.
So that's covers the entire

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spectrum on the organizational
chain there.

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Yes, so.
So when I first started, I

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didn't know exactly what I
wanted to do.

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It's interesting, my dad was an
accountant when I was growing up

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and when I went to college he
said you have to leave college

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with something you can actually
do.

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That's fair.
So he said, you can be a

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teacher, you can be a nurse, you
can, you know, do something in

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business, but you must leave
college.

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So he was never going to agree
to, you know, art history or,

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you know, archaeology or
anything that I had to do

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something more.
So.

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And he loved business.
So and I watched him love it.

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And so I was like, I think I'm
going to study business.

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What age was that at?
So that was probably early in my

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college career, like maybe my
freshman year, and I think I got

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the talk about you have to have
something you can actually do

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when you graduate.
Before I went, it's kind of

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interesting.
I'm the oldest and my younger

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siblings didn't get that talk.
Right.

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We're both the oldest too, so we
know how that.

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Trend works.
So later when I was talking to

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them about it, they're like, no,
Dad never told us that at all.

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I of course thought that was
humorous and a little bit like,

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OK, was I like the scapegoat or
the trial for everything?

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Right.
So, so that was kind of how I

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came to business and he had done
a lot of different things.

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He was, he was actually a
controller and a general manager

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for a steel company.
It was his last role, and so he

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had kind of tried to be
strategic about what he did and

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getting all the experience that
he felt like he needed to do

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that because he knew that was
what he wanted to do.

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And so he kind of coached me to
don't be afraid to try something

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new, you know, learn the whole
way.

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And so that's kind of how I've
been from one place to the other

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is learning basically.
Would you say you learned more

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as an auditor in your first
years or as a CFO?

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I would say more about different
things in those spaces.

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So you know, when you first get
out of school, you're trying to

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hone the skills that everyone
thinks you have from school, but

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you really don't.
You're faking it till you make.

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It right, you're in the fake it
till you make it stage in those

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first couple of jobs, because as
good as school is, it's not the

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real world.
And when you get out in the real

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world, you actually learn a ton
of new things and different

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things than they teach you in
school.

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You know, the school's a great
foundation, but you've got to

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move on.
Agreed 100%, especially in the

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accounting finance world, which
my degree is in accounting as

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well from Clemson, which is
where Heath and I met.

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But I know with accounting that
you kind of have to pick between

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one of two routes, either tax or
audit, right?

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So how did you choose the auto
route?

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So I actually didn't have to
fully choose that until I was a

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little bit older.
So when I first started, I

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worked for a small CPA firm at
my very first job was a large

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company and I worked in internal
audit for them.

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So I was already in the audit
space then.

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And then I realized that my boss
was not ACPA, so I couldn't get,

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yeah, I couldn't get my CPA
license under him.

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Oh, because you need that extra.
Year, that's exactly right.

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You need experience and you have
to have somebody who is ACPA

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sign off on your experience,
right.

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And so I had spent two years
there and had great experience.

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At what point did you realize he
wasn't a CPA?

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I.
Want to say it was probably

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about six months in.
So then I was just kind of

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watching and thinking about, OK,
what are the things I want to

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learn from this experience, But
I know I'm going to have to make

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a change because I don't have
anybody to sign off on this.

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Had you passed all your exams
already?

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So I had not passed all my
exams, but I had started.

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So at that time we actually,
I've been a CPA for a while, so

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this is going to date me, but we
actually.

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We.
Went, we went and sat, We used

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to have to go and sit at the
fairgrounds in Columbia in on a

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long table all by yourself.
You actually hand wrote, yeah on

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the test and it was multiple
hours and days.

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So to do all the parts.
So, but you could, you could as

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long as you pass 2 parts, you
could take the extra parts

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again.
So, so I started working on

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that, started working on skills
and started trying to figure

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out, OK, what's the next step
going to be?

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So my first step away from
internal audit was in a small

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CPA firm.
And I did do audit work, but I

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also did tax work for my so I
did a little of both.

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That's great.
And I always thought tax work

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was interesting, but it doesn't
have enough people time and I

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really needed more people time.
You know, I was like, I feel

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like I might be shriveling up
here, you know?

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Those skills deteriorate.
I felt my people skills.

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I'm an engineer and we.
Coded.

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A lot.
And I felt those skills just

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kind of like deteriorate
overtime.

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OK, because you're not
practicing exactly you're using

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them, right.
So I just, that was driving me

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crazy.
So, so I knew that being behind

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a desk all the time was not
going to be good for me.

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And thankfully, when you're an
auditor, you get in your car,

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you drive to the location where
the company is, you learn you

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know all about their company.
So.

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You're on site with them.
I mean, you do have some office

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time, but a lot of times you're
out in their location doing the

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actual auto work.
And because then you have access

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to them, you can ask questions
right get get stuff addressed

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right there in the field.
So when you are auditing another

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company, they're taking you on,
obviously, to go over the books,

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make sure everything's correct.
What was the response typically

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if you found something that they
weren't aware of?

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Right, like you always hear,
people don't like auditors.

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Yeah, sure, it's not a warm
welcome.

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No, it is not.
No, it is not a warm wet 1.

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So when you work in ACPA firm
though, the welcome is

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different.
So now sometimes they'll put you

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in a room that's not
comfortable, doesn't have

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windows, you know, so and
they're punishing you because

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you're there.
To review their stuff.

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You know, so, but most of the
time when they're paying for

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their audit like they do with
CPA firms, they want you to have

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what you need.
They want you to make sure that

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the people you need to talk to
are available for you.

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So it's a little bit different
than when you are in an internal

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audit role inside of the
company.

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I think actually there's a
little more animosity there

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because whatever department or
segment of the business that

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you're reviewing, they might not
have been super aware that you

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were going to be coming until
maybe 6 or 8 weeks before you

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arrive.
You know, So it's depending on

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the company that can feel a
little more like people are not

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happy.
And and some bookkeeping can be

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subjective like certain areas,
Yeah.

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So it can be kind of far.
It's not like always a black and

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white yes or no kind of thing to
follow.

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Yes.
So I think that's why a lot of

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people love accounting, but they
don't like auditing because when

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we're auditing something in
somebody's books, you know,

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we're, we're thinking about
materiality and there are a lot

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of things we're not going to dig
super deep into that.

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Maybe an accountant might be
like, oh, I'm $0.05 off, I've

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got to get this right.
And we're like, no, that's not

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material.
And so we have different ways

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that we look at it and, and
sometimes people just don't want

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to function in that space that
makes them uncomfortable.

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They need a hard, fast, yes or
no answer.

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They're a little more black and
white, so thankfully as I've

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gotten older I've gotten
probably less black and white,

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which my husband says is a
really good thing.

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That's funny.
And he's an engineer, too.

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He's an engineer too, yes.
It's kind of interesting that

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you guys have our saying yes.
Yes, same time you think going

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on yes, well, that's funny
though, between tax and audit, I

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do feel like at Clemson, I kind
of had a similar realization

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that you did in the I knew I
liked working in numbers, but I

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wanted to work with people and
audit was not the route I wanted

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to go actually.
So that's why I moved into the

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financial services industry and
married numbers and people and

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it's been great.
But I do feel like a lot of my

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classmates that graduated with
me in accounting, the majority

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went into tax accounting versus
audit.

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So yes, and a lot of the
internships were in tax

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accounting.
So I feel like that probably

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changes each year as to how many
students go into tax versus

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audit.
But at least for my class, I

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know the majority went into tax
and are still in it, which is

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pretty cool so that.
Is was your internship with tax

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or audit when you did accounting
internships?

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It was a unique internship in
that I didn't work directly with

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ACPA firm, so I was more so just
handling the books for a smaller

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organization.
You were actually doing

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accounting?
Yes, ma'am.

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So it was kind of anything and
everything when you were.

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That one it's not always binary
tax or audit.

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Right.
If you go to one of the BIG4

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firms per, then yes, you're
either tax or audit.

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And there's not really a bunch
of the small business items that

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I got to see.
But it was a great experience

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and that I felt like I saw
everything there is to know

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about accounting with a
business.

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And that's ultimately what drove
me to go into financial services

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today.
It's been a great journey, but I

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love hearing about your story
because it brings me back to my

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accounting days.
Well, and I think there are a

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lot of people too.
Like one of the things I

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realized early, I did some
internships when I was in

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college and realized that I
didn't want to be an accountant

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because not only did I not want
to be married just to numbers

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like a lot of tax folks are, but
I also didn't want to be married

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to a cycle like third day of the
month.

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This is what we do 5th day.
I was like, I need more variety

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than that.
And so auditing was really great

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for variety because you were out
in a different company, you

230
00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:06,680
know, every on different things,
meeting with different people.

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So the variety was really,
really good for me.

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How does the day-to-day and the
obstacles compare from the

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auditor level to the CFO level?
So I feel like we, we talked

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00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:23,360
just a minute ago about, you
know, were they equally hard,

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You know, and I feel like at the
CFO level, you're doing a lot

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00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:33,800
more dealing with interpersonal
things inside of the

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organization because you're
trying to lead a financial

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strategy that will support the
operational work of the

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organization.
And so you're having to deal

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with people in all of those
different levels, in all of

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00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:52,800
those different places.
So there's a lot more, you know,

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basically just intercompany
politics that you're dealing

243
00:13:56,600 --> 00:14:01,440
with and when you have to say no
or you have to say we have to

244
00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:06,760
make a change, navigating all of
that can be really, really

245
00:14:06,760 --> 00:14:08,960
challenging.
So it's a different kind of

246
00:14:08,960 --> 00:14:11,160
challenge.
You know, you've built your

247
00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:15,920
skills, your accounting and your
audit kind of skills, and now

248
00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:20,000
you're moving into really
significant people skills.

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00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:23,760
And not just the we're meeting
each each other, but the hard

250
00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:26,360
like, I've got to tell you
something you don't want to

251
00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:28,320
hear.
And we've got to figure out

252
00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:32,760
together how to go forward.
And we've got to because we want

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this company to succeed and grow
and thrive.

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00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:39,720
What encourage you to go from
the CFO position to starting

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00:14:39,720 --> 00:14:48,760
your own company?
Thank you for spending your

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00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:51,400
valuable time with us.
We know you're likely incredibly

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00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:53,920
busy and we truly appreciate you
tuning in.

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00:14:54,400 --> 00:14:56,960
We hope you're finding these
insights just as valuable as we

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00:14:56,960 --> 00:14:58,680
are.
Throughout this journey, we've

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00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:01,080
been fortunate to receive
incredible support with many

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00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:03,400
people asking how can we help or
how can we support you?

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00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:06,560
If you haven't already, one of
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00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:10,120
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00:15:10,320 --> 00:15:12,040
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00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:14,640
It just takes a second.
You don't even have to pause the

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00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:16,560
episode.
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00:15:16,560 --> 00:15:19,360
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00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:20,760
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00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:23,040
Thank you again for being part
of this journey.

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00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:31,840
Now let's get back to our guest.
So one of the things that I

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00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:36,600
think a lot of people who are at
those more C-Suite spaces come

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00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:41,840
to realize is that the
organization or the job is

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probably the biggest part of
their life.

274
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It becomes one of the biggest
parts of their life.

275
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And it's kind of hard to keep a
balance.

276
00:15:50,080 --> 00:15:55,600
And I had some things that were
changing in my family that

277
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really meant that I needed to be
able to focus a little bit more

278
00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:04,000
on some other things too.
And so I needed a little bit

279
00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:10,440
more control over my part of the
career and how it interacted

280
00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:14,040
with the rest of my life.
So that was really like the

281
00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:18,360
first thing that started giving
me a little nudge.

282
00:16:18,400 --> 00:16:22,240
I had started when my children
were young.

283
00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:26,800
I worked from home and I had my
own little small tax practice.

284
00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:33,600
So I did that for the first
probably five years that my

285
00:16:33,600 --> 00:16:36,920
daughter, after we had my
daughter and loved that.

286
00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:41,680
I did it in Colombia and I did
it also in North Augusta, SC.

287
00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:43,680
That's where we lived when our
first child was born.

288
00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:49,080
And so, so I had done, I had
helped start things, I helped

289
00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:52,120
start some other stuff as my
kids were growing up, like

290
00:16:52,520 --> 00:16:57,280
submitted the paperwork to the
IRS for nonprofit status and you

291
00:16:57,280 --> 00:17:01,040
know, things like that.
So it wasn't, it wasn't totally

292
00:17:01,040 --> 00:17:05,920
new to me to think about
starting that own thing and, and

293
00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:09,680
just going out on my own.
And thankfully I had a really

294
00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:14,440
supportive partner and my
husband, he was like, yes, I

295
00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:17,680
think you need to do this.
I think the time is now.

296
00:17:18,040 --> 00:17:23,839
And so, you know, after after
2020, I think a lot of us just

297
00:17:23,839 --> 00:17:29,640
started pondering about what do
we want our life to be like?

298
00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:35,760
And is the life that maybe our
culture tells us we need to

299
00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:38,120
have?
Is that really what we want to

300
00:17:38,120 --> 00:17:39,560
choose?
So.

301
00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:42,040
Yeah.
Supportive spouse has been a

302
00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:44,160
common theme with a lot of
business owners that we've

303
00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:45,040
talked to.
Yeah.

304
00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:49,160
It's like in this, yes.
Yeah, absolutely.

305
00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:53,000
Because in starting a business
you really are taking a risk.

306
00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:57,520
You're going from, Yeah, study
income usually to then, OK, I

307
00:17:57,520 --> 00:18:01,200
don't have a guaranteed income.
I'm taking a huge risk with a

308
00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:04,520
family I'm supporting.
And so we have seen that as a

309
00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:07,400
common theme and that most
entrepreneurs we meet with here

310
00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:10,040
are like, this could not have
been done without a support

311
00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:12,640
partner, which is great for us
to hear, you know, so early in

312
00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:15,880
our marriage, in our careers.
And so thank you for sharing

313
00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:17,760
that.
But yeah, it's a good challenge

314
00:18:17,760 --> 00:18:21,720
to you guys to think about what
is a supportive partner look

315
00:18:21,720 --> 00:18:25,840
like in a marriage?
Like, how do I be that for my

316
00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:28,720
spouse?
Whether it's listening or

317
00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,320
encouraging or saying, hey, the
time is now to jump.

318
00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:36,360
Right, right.
And with your big jump too, I do

319
00:18:36,360 --> 00:18:39,280
want to talk to you a little bit
about the Sage perspective.

320
00:18:39,280 --> 00:18:42,800
So this is obviously your baby
in your business right now.

321
00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:45,760
So you're the founder, the
owner, it's still relatively

322
00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:48,960
new, but you've had a ton of
success with it in a short

323
00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:51,160
amount of time.
So if you don't mind, just share

324
00:18:51,160 --> 00:18:55,160
with us how that really started
when you started the company and

325
00:18:55,160 --> 00:19:02,240
what you're doing.
So I started in the fall of on

326
00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:06,080
23.
So I started thinking about I

327
00:19:06,160 --> 00:19:09,520
had to figure out, I had to
figure out what did I actually

328
00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:12,640
want it to be?
You know, like what did I want

329
00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:15,880
to do?
Because I have fields in lots of

330
00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:20,120
different spaces, so I needed to
figure out, OK, what is really

331
00:19:20,120 --> 00:19:22,800
the product.
First of all, that I think is

332
00:19:22,920 --> 00:19:27,480
helpful to organizations that I
know of here in Greenville.

333
00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:32,640
I primarily work in the upstate.
I can work remotely, but I don't

334
00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:35,840
do a ton of remote work just
because I don't really, I don't

335
00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:40,640
really have connections in, you
know, Texas or, you know, New

336
00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:43,400
Jersey.
So I work in the places that

337
00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:48,720
people know me, you know, So I
started thinking about what

338
00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:52,400
dude, I want it to be first.
And then I started trying to

339
00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:57,560
figure out how to how to kind of
marry my skill set that I had

340
00:19:57,560 --> 00:20:02,600
developed in those places to it.
So I actually probably use more

341
00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:07,720
of my audit skills in this role
than I ever would have thought.

342
00:20:08,120 --> 00:20:14,240
Because we used to tease in one
of my last audit roles that we

343
00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:18,640
were professional question
askers and you know.

344
00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:21,680
Important skill It is an.
Important skill and knowing what

345
00:20:21,680 --> 00:20:25,480
question to ask and when.
And that's a huge part of what I

346
00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:31,480
do now is ask questions, help
people to take maybe what they

347
00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:36,120
thought about a set of facts and
circumstances and change how

348
00:20:36,120 --> 00:20:39,800
they're thinking about it.
And questions are how I get

349
00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:41,600
there.
And questions are how I help

350
00:20:41,600 --> 00:20:45,040
them figure out where do we
really want this company to go?

351
00:20:45,120 --> 00:20:49,720
You know, when I step into a
company with somebody else, I

352
00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:53,440
don't, I don't know what they
want their company to be.

353
00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:56,720
And I'm trying to help them
figure that out so they can have

354
00:20:56,720 --> 00:21:00,240
the best experience as an
entrepreneur or as a small

355
00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:03,920
business owner as possible,
because that's my goal, is to

356
00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:08,520
help them thrive in the space
they want to work in.

357
00:21:09,120 --> 00:21:11,640
So I've been told before that if
you know accounting, you know

358
00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:14,360
business.
Do you agree or disagree with

359
00:21:14,360 --> 00:21:17,880
this and why?
So I agree with it in some

360
00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:22,480
spaces, like, you know what, you
know, accounting is a great data

361
00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:26,920
source and data is very
important for making good

362
00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:31,640
decisions in business.
So, so from that perspective,

363
00:21:31,640 --> 00:21:34,760
absolutely.
Is that the only perspective

364
00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:36,760
that's really important to
running a business?

365
00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:39,520
No.
So, you know, you can be a great

366
00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:44,600
data person and not be a great,
you know, reader of the room,

367
00:21:44,600 --> 00:21:47,000
not be a great salesperson.
Yeah.

368
00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:51,080
Not be able to lead well.
So I think it's it's a great

369
00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:56,840
skill set to have and I I apply
it a lot with my clients, but

370
00:21:56,840 --> 00:22:00,080
it's not the only skill set.
With your previous business

371
00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:02,480
venture, was it solely
accounting?

372
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:07,320
So yes, my previous business
venture was a lot more

373
00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:13,320
accounting and even doing like
audit work for companies that

374
00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:16,560
small companies or companies
that were getting ready to need

375
00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:18,680
to have an audit, an external
audit.

376
00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:21,760
And they wanted somebody to look
at stuff and give them some

377
00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:24,840
feedback about it before they're
before they actually paid an

378
00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:26,640
auditor.
Like they might know they had a

379
00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:31,360
problem in a certain area.
So but I realized I didn't want

380
00:22:31,360 --> 00:22:35,000
to do that.
That wasn't really what made my

381
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:37,400
heart sing.
And I didn't think it would be

382
00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:41,400
the best thing for small
business owners.

383
00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:42,800
What is it that makes your heart
sing?

384
00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:46,440
So it may really makes my heart
sing when the light bulbs start

385
00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:51,360
going off for people and they
start going, Oh yeah, you need

386
00:22:51,360 --> 00:22:53,880
to be focusing on that.
Oh yeah, those are good

387
00:22:53,880 --> 00:22:56,760
questions.
Oh yeah, that's a good, I call

388
00:22:56,760 --> 00:23:02,560
them rocks.
Like that's a good, a good KPI

389
00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:07,200
key performance indicator for
this specific role.

390
00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:11,040
And that person needs to know
that's what they need to do to

391
00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:12,520
make us successful.
So.

392
00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:14,120
You're still a professional
question asker.

393
00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:16,720
Yes, I'm still a professional
question asker.

394
00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:18,680
That's exactly right.
That's exactly right.

395
00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:21,960
Because I can't get to.
I hope them work with strategy,

396
00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:25,200
also help them work on
operational things because I

397
00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:29,880
found strategic, operational and
financial things are the three

398
00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:34,160
key areas for businesses that
something goes off and that's

399
00:23:34,160 --> 00:23:36,760
how they get in one of those
pain points.

400
00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:41,640
I say I work with businesses in
about 6 to 8 different key pain

401
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:47,760
points and they feel the pain in
that point, but they might not

402
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:50,960
know what the source of the pain
is.

403
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:54,920
And my job is to ask questions
and help them get to the root

404
00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:59,600
cause so we can fix it and so we
can develop a better way to do

405
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:02,040
it so we don't have to have that
pain point.

406
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:04,520
So.
Would you agree that a business,

407
00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:06,520
if it's not growing, then it's
dying?

408
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:13,640
Yes and no.
SO this is back to the I'm not

409
00:24:13,640 --> 00:24:15,600
as white and black as I used to
be.

410
00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:19,760
You know, like there's not only
one right answer to a question,

411
00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:25,520
but I feel like, you know,
there's a time if you don't have

412
00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:29,840
good structure internally,
you're not ready to grow.

413
00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:35,120
So you, there are times when a
business has to really focus,

414
00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:41,280
stop and focus on how they do
business operationally.

415
00:24:41,400 --> 00:24:43,720
How are we doing business
financially?

416
00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:49,160
Do we have all of the pieces
lined up to help protect us and

417
00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:52,440
provide what we need for that
next stage of growth?

418
00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:56,800
So I would say just because
you're not growing doesn't mean

419
00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:59,840
you're dying or doesn't mean
you're stagnant.

420
00:25:00,360 --> 00:25:04,600
It may mean you're preparing
and, and there's a really good

421
00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:09,520
place and a really good case for
preparing before you try to

422
00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:11,760
grow.
A lot of times a company will

423
00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:15,520
like hit a ceiling and they
don't know how to get over it.

424
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:19,720
And most of the time I've found,
or a lot of the times anyway,

425
00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:23,760
that ceiling they're hitting,
it's because they need to do

426
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:27,400
some preparatory work, you know,
like they're doing as much as

427
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:31,080
they can do with the people that
they have and the the processes

428
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:34,120
that they have.
So maybe they need to do some.

429
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:38,800
Sometimes I tell companies
you're doing too many things.

430
00:25:39,120 --> 00:25:43,200
You know, there are certain
things you need to focus on that

431
00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:48,360
are better margin providers,
help you grow your revenue and

432
00:25:48,360 --> 00:25:53,040
you're spread too thin if you
try to do 5 things versus doing

433
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:58,120
two things.
I found a lot of entrepreneurs

434
00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:00,240
are idea people.
Yeah.

435
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:05,120
And so they get an idea, and
they're like, oh, I've got to,

436
00:26:05,120 --> 00:26:08,760
like, institute this idea.
I need to start a new segment in

437
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:12,920
my business and do this thing.
And sometimes that's not always

438
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,440
really true.
And they don't, like, tap the

439
00:26:16,440 --> 00:26:19,480
brakes and let somebody ask them
questions.

440
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:24,360
So I'm trying to teach most of
my clients to tap their brakes

441
00:26:24,520 --> 00:26:28,800
to send me an e-mail, let's have
a conversation.

442
00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:32,320
Sometimes I'm going to say, hey,
I'm like your supportive

443
00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:35,440
partner, go for it.
This is a great idea.

444
00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:37,920
You've got infrastructure in
place to do it.

445
00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:41,600
I think that's, you know, here's
here's what we can probably make

446
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:43,960
doing it.
We can do some projected,

447
00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:48,360
projected cash flows for them
for that new segment.

448
00:26:48,360 --> 00:26:50,600
And we might pull the trigger
and say, yeah, we need to do

449
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:52,720
this.
But sometimes we also need to

450
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:57,400
say, is this really our core
business, what we're really good

451
00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:59,480
at?
And does it make sense to

452
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:02,600
include this if it's not that
core?

453
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:08,240
And speaking about preparation
and ideas and you are obviously

454
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:11,200
coaching business owners and
helping them grow, but then

455
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:14,440
you've got your own business
that you are growing and

456
00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:16,880
launched.
And so how long were you

457
00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:19,200
prepping to launch the Sage
perspective?

458
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:21,040
Like when did that idea come to
mind?

459
00:27:21,360 --> 00:27:24,960
And from the moment of the idea,
you know, how long was it till

460
00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:27,720
day one of the Sage?
And then what obstacles did you

461
00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:29,960
face in launching the Sage
perspective?

462
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:32,560
So I.
Think every.

463
00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:36,760
I think probably every
entrepreneur like has an idea,

464
00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:40,440
yeah, at some point in time.
And my, I think I really started

465
00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:45,000
sitting with the idea of what I
do in Sage now in the summer

466
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:50,120
before I started Sage in early
24.

467
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:56,360
So I started sitting with the
idea and I like, second guessed

468
00:27:56,360 --> 00:28:01,560
myself and thought, you know,
tapped my brakes.

469
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:06,120
And I had some really good
friends who kept asking me,

470
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:11,520
what's making your heart sing?
And what is it that you really

471
00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:16,680
feel like you were made to do?
You know, that's what we need to

472
00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:22,440
focus on is what is that?
So I read voraciously, like a

473
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:28,080
lot of next step books, like,
OK, I'm in a pivot time and I'm

474
00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:32,480
trying to figure out what the
business pivot to is going to

475
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,760
be.
And I started praying, asking

476
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:40,560
the Lord like what, what am I
really good at and what can what

477
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:44,000
are the ways I can help people
in my community?

478
00:28:44,200 --> 00:28:49,400
One of the things I think that
sadly, as a culture, we've kind

479
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:53,840
of sometimes demonized business
owners and sometimes business

480
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:59,080
owners make bad choices and, you
know, need to have somebody from

481
00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:02,720
the outside say that was not a
good choice and you've hurt your

482
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:07,440
employees and you've.
But businesses by and large are

483
00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:12,280
what makes our economy and our
families and our communities

484
00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:17,680
grow and thrive.
So I was like, I want to help a

485
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:23,160
business owner help his family
or her family, help their

486
00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:27,440
community that they live in,
help, you know, the upstate help

487
00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:30,800
Greenville grow and be all we
can be.

488
00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:36,160
And, and if I don't do something
that I feel like I'm good at in

489
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:40,320
that space, then I'm going to be
not using the skills I've been

490
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:42,960
given.
You know, so that was kind of

491
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:47,760
how I, it took me about probably
six months to get to where I was

492
00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:51,920
ready to launch.
The ideas were first and then

493
00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:55,000
the, oh, I can't do this And
yes, you can.

494
00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:58,600
And you know, all of that.
But then I had to really start

495
00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:02,200
doing the process, like building
the plan.

496
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:05,240
That's exactly right.
What would this look like and

497
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:08,840
how many clients would I need to
have and how quickly would I

498
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:12,520
need to, you know, sales funnels
and how quickly how many people

499
00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:16,240
do I have to have in my sales
funnel to have three conversions

500
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:18,840
and actually create a new
client?

501
00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:21,640
And how many clients can I
really do?

502
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:22,960
How many can you handle?
Yeah, can.

503
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:28,840
I handle and really do a good
job of and really have time for

504
00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:32,760
those other things that I want
to be like being involved in

505
00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:37,720
other civic organizations here
in Greenville, being involved in

506
00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:40,400
my family's life, those kinds of
things.

507
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:45,000
What was day one like?
It was terrifying.

508
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:52,000
It was terrifying.
So day one for me was I went to

509
00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:56,960
a networking event.
I had a friend invite me to go

510
00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:01,120
to this networking event and I,
and I said, I'm going to take

511
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:03,800
pictures here, I'm going to post
here.

512
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:07,760
And that is how I'm going to
announce on LinkedIn that this

513
00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:11,120
is what I'm doing.
Now, I already had my website

514
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:13,760
together.
You know, my processes,

515
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:16,800
documented, a business plan, all
of that.

516
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:20,840
But I hadn't actually officially
said it in public.

517
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:24,800
You know, people who knew me
knew what I was going to do, but

518
00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:28,520
I hadn't said it in public.
And so that was how I first

519
00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:32,400
launched was I went to a
networking event with a friend,

520
00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:36,080
took pictures and said, this is
who I am and this is what I'm

521
00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:38,200
doing.
Please check my website.

522
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:45,160
And that's so fun.
So what are we can go back to

523
00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:48,080
actually the SAGE perspective
when you were starting it and

524
00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:50,920
you talked about day one, what
are the first like processes or

525
00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:52,800
I guess the first week, the
first month, what were some of

526
00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:55,560
the goals and strategies that
you put into place?

527
00:31:55,600 --> 00:32:01,920
So really for my first year, for
the first whole year, I felt

528
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:07,320
like I was learning about how to
talk about my business to other

529
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:12,120
people because I had never
worked in a role where I had to

530
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:17,440
sell myself or my product to
somebody outside.

531
00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:18,040
That's fair.
Yeah.

532
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:21,640
So I had to really figure out.
Some new skill.

533
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:23,720
Right.
It was a totally new skill.

534
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:27,840
So I felt like for the first
year I was really developing

535
00:32:27,840 --> 00:32:34,560
that skill and also figuring out
how to talk about how your

536
00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:40,720
business makes you feel.
Because as an auditor and ACPA,

537
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:44,400
we don't talk about how numbers
make us feel.

538
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:49,000
We talk about what we need to do
with numbers, what we think

539
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:53,000
about numbers.
Now, we all know that we don't

540
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:57,440
make decisions based on facts.
We make them based on our

541
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:02,040
feelings, emotions.
So I had to really figure out

542
00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:07,560
how to talk about emotions
related to business processes

543
00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:10,560
and pain points.
How does that, how does that

544
00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:13,840
make us feel?
And how can we feel if we

545
00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:17,000
address those pain points?
So like, here's how you're

546
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:22,720
feeling now and we want to help
you feel settled.

547
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:25,680
We want to help you feel not
overwhelmed.

548
00:33:25,920 --> 00:33:30,880
We want to help you feel like
your business will run if you

549
00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:33,560
take a vacation.
You know, I mean, those are

550
00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:36,720
really important things.
You know, people need vacations,

551
00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:40,320
but there are a lot of times
we're petrified of.

552
00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:43,960
Even if we work for a large
company like Heath, you may feel

553
00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:47,960
like you have to check your your
e-mail when you're on vacation,

554
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:51,240
you know?
Well, how do we help a company

555
00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:58,080
be operationally steady enough
that a business owner doesn't

556
00:33:58,080 --> 00:34:01,000
have to be there all the time?
So are you typically working

557
00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:04,360
with smaller businesses within
the Upstate or like larger

558
00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:08,239
corporations?
So most of most of my businesses

559
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:13,960
are 2 million and under in
revenue and anywhere from being

560
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:19,679
a solopreneur to being somebody
who's got maybe 10 or 12

561
00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:23,639
employees.
So not large organizations.

562
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:29,320
So I'm working with people who
are supporting the BMW's of the

563
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:31,480
world.
You know I'm not working with

564
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,280
the BMW's of the world.
You know, and that's your sweet

565
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:37,239
spot too.
Selena and I thankfully have

566
00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:39,560
been able to have lunch and get
to know each other over the last

567
00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:42,960
few months, but I think you've
done a great job in figuring out

568
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:46,320
who do I want to work with and
who do I work best with.

569
00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:49,719
Like you've talked so much about
the people you're working with

570
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:52,560
and how much y'all are aligned
and how you can really jump into

571
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:56,120
their boat and paddle with them.
Because it's totally different

572
00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:58,960
when you're with a huge
corporation and there's all

573
00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:01,840
these people involved versus
what you're doing where you can

574
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:05,120
have a direct impact with that
owner and jump in with their

575
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:07,800
leadership team.
Yes, you did a great job kind of

576
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:10,560
figuring out what your ideal
client or business owner is.

577
00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:14,960
Yes, but that took a good chunk
of my first year, like learning

578
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:20,120
how to talk about what I do and
the product, the service that I

579
00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:24,400
provide and why it's important.
And then also figuring out, OK,

580
00:35:24,720 --> 00:35:27,280
who do I really?
Who's really my best fit?

581
00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:31,520
Who can I best serve in this
venture?

582
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:34,320
So what from what you've seen so
far working in the Sage

583
00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:36,920
perspective, what have been some
of the things that have kept

584
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:39,280
companies back from growing or
reaching that next?

585
00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:44,280
Level so a lot of times they
don't they they're really,

586
00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:49,320
really good at what they do like
they have an idea of something

587
00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:52,680
they love that they want to do
kind of like I had something

588
00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:56,080
that made my heart sing.
They have something that makes

589
00:35:56,080 --> 00:36:01,240
their heart sing too and and
they put their head down and

590
00:36:01,240 --> 00:36:04,160
they do it and they're really
good at doing it.

591
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:06,680
But they have, they don't ever
bring their head up and look

592
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:10,120
around and go like what's
happening in the rest of this

593
00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:12,560
business or where do I want to
be in a year.

594
00:36:12,720 --> 00:36:16,840
They're so busy having their
head down that they don't they

595
00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:20,880
can't, they don't have time or
bandwidth to get out of that

596
00:36:20,880 --> 00:36:23,600
operational mode.
It's like they go into

597
00:36:23,600 --> 00:36:26,720
operational mode and they don't
know how to do anything else.

598
00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:30,480
And so I tried by asking
questions, I try to help them

599
00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:35,800
raise their head and look out
and see, OK, where we are right

600
00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:38,960
now is not where we want to
always be be.

601
00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:43,840
And what is it that we want this
to actually be one day?

602
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:47,840
How do we think out?
You know, sometimes it's 10

603
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:49,760
years, sometimes it's five
years.

604
00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:55,080
Not everybody sees a long term
plan as A10 or A-15 or A20 year

605
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:58,360
plan for a business.
Sometimes they do, but most of

606
00:36:58,360 --> 00:37:02,360
the time it's 5 to to 10 years.
So we're really looking out and

607
00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:06,640
going, what do we want this to
look like in 5 to 10 years?

608
00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:10,360
Some business owners don't want
to be doing it in five years,

609
00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:15,360
You know, So we talk a lot
about, OK, how do we get ready

610
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:19,480
to either have somebody who's
already on our leadership team

611
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:23,440
step into your role, or how do
we get ready to sell this

612
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:25,520
business?
You know, those are things that

613
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:29,360
we have to think about, too.
How do we do that?

614
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:34,600
So, so basically just helping
them raise their head and get a

615
00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:37,560
different perspective on the
organization.

616
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:41,200
That's probably the biggest
thing that I do.

617
00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:46,120
They a lot of times realize the
pain point that they realize

618
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:50,440
they're having because they're
so operational is they're

619
00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:55,240
overwhelmed.
A lot of times they don't know,

620
00:37:55,240 --> 00:37:58,440
they don't have any idea
strategically what their cash

621
00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:01,400
flow is going to look like in
four weeks or even 2 weeks.

622
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:02,840
No idea.
They don't write.

623
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:06,600
They might have limited ideas,
but they don't have the kind of

624
00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:09,120
idea that helps them not feel
overwhelmed.

625
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:13,680
Because most of us, if we're in,
if we're running a business and

626
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:19,800
there's something about it that
feels unsafe financially or

627
00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:25,520
insecure, it creates anxiety for
us as people, you know, we want

628
00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:29,640
to feel safe about being able to
pay our team.

629
00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:34,080
We want to feel safe about being
able to take a check ourselves.

630
00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:40,320
So if they have any financial
insecurity, a lot of times it

631
00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:45,000
relates to cash flow.
I have found sometimes it

632
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:48,600
relates to, hey, we feel like
we're missing opportunities,

633
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:53,720
like they're hearing about a job
that somebody else one maybe in

634
00:38:53,720 --> 00:38:57,480
their industry and they're like,
why didn't I get a chance?

635
00:38:57,640 --> 00:39:00,040
You know, that was an
opportunity that I missed.

636
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:04,880
So figuring out how to get them
out of their operational weeds

637
00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:10,160
so that they can be aware of
opportunities and and and work

638
00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:13,440
at them and propose on them when
appropriate.

639
00:39:13,720 --> 00:39:17,000
Have you ever seen that worst
case scenario with when cash

640
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:18,720
flow does halt?
Have you ever seen the worst

641
00:39:18,720 --> 00:39:20,360
case scenario happen?
Yes.

642
00:39:20,760 --> 00:39:23,840
Yes.
So when I was early in my career

643
00:39:24,320 --> 00:39:31,720
working for CPA firm, we had a,
we had a city, a local city in

644
00:39:31,720 --> 00:39:34,280
the community that was one of
our clients.

645
00:39:34,720 --> 00:39:42,280
And they went through a total
cash flow disaster and their,

646
00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:47,800
their controller left because
and he was like, I'm not putting

647
00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:51,760
up with this, you know, having
decide who gets paid each week.

648
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:55,000
I'm, I'm just not doing.
They couldn't pay everybody.

649
00:39:55,120 --> 00:39:57,000
Yes, they couldn't pay all their
vendors.

650
00:39:57,000 --> 00:39:59,440
They couldn't pay.
And they were doing like a major

651
00:39:59,440 --> 00:40:02,320
construction project on their
rib on the riverfront.

652
00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:05,880
And that was a big part of what
was happening.

653
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:09,360
So I actually got assigned to go
over.

654
00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:13,920
Once a week and help them figure
out what bills to pay for the

655
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:16,600
next week.
So that was my very first

656
00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:22,960
introduction as a young auditor.
I was probably in my late 20s.

657
00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:26,600
That was my first introduction
to a total cash flow disaster.

658
00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:33,880
Now, now I have small business
clients who get into not

659
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:38,720
probably as sensitive a space,
but they get really close to

660
00:40:38,720 --> 00:40:43,120
that where they're like, OK, I
had to borrow money from, you

661
00:40:43,120 --> 00:40:47,000
know, basically a small business
loan shark, you know, and I'm

662
00:40:47,000 --> 00:40:49,160
having to pay really high
interest on it.

663
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:52,720
And I've got to figure out how
to get out of this cash flow

664
00:40:52,720 --> 00:40:57,120
situation.
So, you know, they come with a

665
00:40:57,120 --> 00:41:00,560
lot of feelings.
That's yeah, that's terrifying.

666
00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:03,920
Right.
And I feel like even before we

667
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,480
got on the podcast, we talked
about the importance of an

668
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:09,640
outside perspective.
So you coming in and helping

669
00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:12,400
these companies get back on
their feet, whether it's cash

670
00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:15,520
flow or something else is so
important because when you're in

671
00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:18,480
the weeds of what you're doing
and you're so caught up in it

672
00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:21,760
with your team and your company,
it's hard to know what do we

673
00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:25,000
need to do.
So part of that outside

674
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:28,000
perspective is so neat and
almost, I feel like needed in

675
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:30,600
every single company.
But how does that tie to the

676
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:33,240
name, the Sage perspective?
How did you come up with that?

677
00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:44,240
So I, I think perspective was
the key start for me in the name

678
00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:48,720
because what we're basically
doing is getting a per new

679
00:41:48,720 --> 00:41:51,640
perspective.
So that was where I first

680
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:56,680
started perfect perspective.
How do we get a new perspective?

681
00:41:57,200 --> 00:42:00,800
And then I was like, well, what
kind of perspective do I want to

682
00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:05,360
help them have?
And I was like, well, I'm older

683
00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:10,720
now, maybe it can be saved.
I love it.

684
00:42:10,720 --> 00:42:12,680
I love it.
And then and although there's

685
00:42:12,680 --> 00:42:15,520
lots of things I'm still
learning too, you know, I would

686
00:42:15,520 --> 00:42:21,120
say anybody who who is not still
learning is stagnating.

687
00:42:21,400 --> 00:42:24,880
You know, even if if you're not
a company, if you're not still

688
00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:27,920
learning and reading and
growing, you are going to

689
00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:29,760
stagnate and you're going to
lose those skills.

690
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:32,120
Kind of like we talked about at
the beginning, he's like, if you

691
00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:35,320
don't practice your
interpersonal communication

692
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:37,360
skills, they drift off.
That's right.

693
00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:43,120
I love that they drift off.
It's a different perspective for

694
00:42:43,120 --> 00:42:46,880
me.
So I, I, I feel like that was

695
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:49,280
how the name kind of came
together for me.

696
00:42:49,520 --> 00:42:54,120
So then of course I went like a
good auditor to the Secretary of

697
00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:58,720
State's website and started
looking to see, OK, cuz sage is

698
00:42:58,720 --> 00:43:03,000
a common name for lots of
different things.

699
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:08,160
So I was like, OK, how do I
marry these words together to

700
00:43:08,160 --> 00:43:11,880
create a name that nobody else
has in South Carolina?

701
00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:15,360
And so that the, the Secretary
of State helped me do that.

702
00:43:15,640 --> 00:43:17,040
So.
He looks through.

703
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:18,960
You're like, here's what's
taken.

704
00:43:19,000 --> 00:43:21,880
Yeah, that's exactly.
That's exactly right.

705
00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:23,000
That's exactly.
Right.

706
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:28,000
And nowadays too, in ChatGPT and
AI, I'm like, I wonder if it

707
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:29,600
could do that work for you, you
know?

708
00:43:29,960 --> 00:43:33,720
Probably they could, we didn't
when when I was trying to decide

709
00:43:33,720 --> 00:43:38,000
what to name this in 23 we
didn't have chat GPS.

710
00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:39,640
It's crazy how far it's calm.
Yeah, yeah.

711
00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:42,520
And then the only people using
it back then were people like

712
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:44,080
Heath and probably your husband.
Like the?

713
00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:47,040
Engineers, but I would just use
it to get ideas and I'm like, it

714
00:43:47,040 --> 00:43:49,160
wasn't like nearly as good as it
is now.

715
00:43:49,240 --> 00:43:50,320
Right.
No, it's amazing.

716
00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:51,880
I'm just saying the engineers
knew about it.

717
00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:53,200
But I thought no.
One else knew right?

718
00:43:53,240 --> 00:43:54,320
The rest?
Of.

719
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:56,800
The Yeah.
Yeah, I knew about used a lot.

720
00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:00,320
Well, how soon did you know
about it, Heath?

721
00:44:00,600 --> 00:44:03,000
I felt like I was late to the
game and I was probably like

722
00:44:03,120 --> 00:44:05,200
four months after it got
released.

723
00:44:05,240 --> 00:44:07,480
Like he was very and.
I felt like I was late just

724
00:44:07,480 --> 00:44:08,840
cause like I was like, have
y'all seen this?

725
00:44:08,840 --> 00:44:11,440
And everyone's like, yeah.
All the rest.

726
00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:12,880
Of you.
So we were kind of talking

727
00:44:12,880 --> 00:44:14,280
there.
It was on our work chat and

728
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:17,120
someone was, I was like, what is
this ChatGPT thing that keeps

729
00:44:17,120 --> 00:44:18,480
getting thrown around our work
chat?

730
00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:19,760
And I was like, well this is
cool.

731
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:21,800
Yeah.
And then like people like me,

732
00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:25,400
non engineers, I feel like got
into it way later.

733
00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:28,520
But yeah, I was using it.
He feels like I've been using

734
00:44:28,520 --> 00:44:31,120
this for a long time now, and
I've been telling to do it.

735
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:32,800
I was like, well, I was
skeptical.

736
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:35,240
If the engineers are obsessing
over something that's usually

737
00:44:35,240 --> 00:44:37,000
over my head and I don't want to
look into it.

738
00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:39,360
Yeah, it.
Might be something I can't do.

739
00:44:39,480 --> 00:44:41,320
Right.
But this is a great resource, so

740
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:45,160
not to say I'm sure it could
certainly help someone starting

741
00:44:45,160 --> 00:44:45,840
a business.
Yeah.

742
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:50,600
Now it could, yeah, absolutely.
Well, and I use it a lot when

743
00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:52,880
I'm.
I'm writing, like when I decide

744
00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:57,040
what I want to post about, I try
to post a couple of times a week

745
00:44:57,280 --> 00:44:59,880
so that people are seeing things
from me.

746
00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:06,760
I have not officially launched
a, a newsletter yet.

747
00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:10,720
That is A1 team yes.
So that's my next step.

748
00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:16,080
I have I have a a database of
people that I've met and I feel

749
00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:19,520
like that's a good way just kind
of keep your because sometimes

750
00:45:19,720 --> 00:45:22,840
people don't have a pain point
when you talk to them the first

751
00:45:22,840 --> 00:45:25,440
time.
It might be 6 months or they

752
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:28,120
might have a friend who gets a
pain point and they remember.

753
00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:30,400
Oh yeah, I talked to Selena
about that.

754
00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:33,400
That's something that the Sage
perspective can help with.

755
00:45:33,800 --> 00:45:37,120
You know, so I feel like just
kind of keeping yourself in

756
00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:40,760
front of people is really
important when you own a small

757
00:45:40,760 --> 00:45:44,920
business, especially in the
tight in the area that I work

758
00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:48,600
in, you know, because people's
pain points come and go.

759
00:45:48,880 --> 00:45:50,400
Yeah.
So we talked about taking the

760
00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:52,920
leap earlier.
How do you know when the time is

761
00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:55,920
right to go from your full time
job to starting your own

762
00:45:55,920 --> 00:45:57,600
business?
Well, you know, it's

763
00:45:57,640 --> 00:45:59,600
interesting.
I've talked to a lot of

764
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:05,920
entrepreneurs about this so and
almost all of them have told me

765
00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:10,960
when you can do it full time,
like when you feel like you've

766
00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:15,840
got enough activity that you can
support yourself the way you

767
00:46:15,840 --> 00:46:18,760
need to, it's time to take the
leap to.

768
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:20,680
Start as a part time and.
Right.

769
00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:22,920
A lot of people started as a
part time.

770
00:46:22,920 --> 00:46:24,840
That's the easiest way, I think.
Yeah.

771
00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:27,800
So that's kind of what I did,
too.

772
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:31,840
I started having ideas and then
I started and then my husband

773
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:34,320
was like, you just need to do
this.

774
00:46:34,600 --> 00:46:36,600
You know, you just need to do
this.

775
00:46:36,600 --> 00:46:41,080
You're going to be happier if
you get this started and go.

776
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:44,760
One of the things, one of the
kind of sad things that I didn't

777
00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:49,200
know before I started, but that
I now preach and remind myself

778
00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:53,880
of is in your first year, you're
going to spend 80% of your time

779
00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:59,160
talking about what you do and
introducing others to it and 20%

780
00:46:59,240 --> 00:47:02,160
doing it.
In year 2, you hope you're going

781
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:06,680
to spend 50% talking about it
and 50% doing it.

782
00:47:07,120 --> 00:47:12,600
And then in year 3 you hope to
spend 80% doing it and 20%

783
00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:16,280
talking about it just because
you've got to build awareness,

784
00:47:16,280 --> 00:47:20,680
you've got to build a following,
you've got to figure out who you

785
00:47:20,680 --> 00:47:23,320
want to work with.
You know, I've heard that.

786
00:47:23,320 --> 00:47:25,440
Before that's good though.
Yeah, it was not a lot.

787
00:47:25,440 --> 00:47:29,080
And then on that topic too, with
taking the leap of your husband

788
00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:31,480
being so supportive and you
trying to balance working time

789
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:33,680
and everything, How do you
balance?

790
00:47:33,680 --> 00:47:36,400
Because you've worked, you know,
a ton in different areas.

791
00:47:36,400 --> 00:47:39,440
How do you balance being a
working mom and wife?

792
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:42,720
But then to you caring for your
family, your kids and travel and

793
00:47:42,720 --> 00:47:44,160
doing the fun things I wanted to
do.

794
00:47:44,520 --> 00:47:46,240
What does that balance look like
for you?

795
00:47:46,640 --> 00:47:51,160
Well, sometimes it's been a
terrible balance, not a balance

796
00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:53,960
at all.
And then other times it's been

797
00:47:53,960 --> 00:47:56,400
better.
And so one of the things that I

798
00:47:56,400 --> 00:48:00,480
did when I decided to do this
was I looked back over my whole

799
00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:05,720
career and I thought about,
okay, when were the times that

800
00:48:05,720 --> 00:48:12,200
my family had its right
perspective in my time and in my

801
00:48:12,200 --> 00:48:17,960
energy and in my just capacity
to love and care and be involved

802
00:48:17,960 --> 00:48:20,720
with them.
When did they have the right

803
00:48:20,720 --> 00:48:25,760
perspective in in that balance
and when did they not?

804
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:32,280
And most of the time it was when
I was in a really high stress

805
00:48:32,720 --> 00:48:37,040
role, maybe because I had a lot
of responsibility or maybe

806
00:48:37,040 --> 00:48:41,720
because I was supporting other
people that had a lot of

807
00:48:41,720 --> 00:48:46,840
responsibility.
And so I just, I found that was

808
00:48:46,840 --> 00:48:50,880
one of the key things I needed
to control was stress.

809
00:48:51,160 --> 00:48:56,360
So I highly recommend
counselors, you know, like, I

810
00:48:56,360 --> 00:49:00,080
think that's a great thing.
Know thyself, you know, like

811
00:49:00,320 --> 00:49:04,200
learn what the stuff is in your
past that's hanging you up and

812
00:49:04,200 --> 00:49:08,440
making it hard for you to be a
good mom or a Good Wife or a

813
00:49:08,440 --> 00:49:12,200
good partner, you know, do those
kinds of things.

814
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:16,120
I also highly recommend anxiety
medication.

815
00:49:16,240 --> 00:49:19,480
You know what I mean?
There's sometimes in my career

816
00:49:19,720 --> 00:49:21,440
that I've really, really needed
that.

817
00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:24,880
There's sometimes I've needed
depression meds, you know, just

818
00:49:24,880 --> 00:49:27,840
because of what was going on
with the organization that I was

819
00:49:27,840 --> 00:49:31,360
working for that was, I was
taking that home a lot.

820
00:49:31,360 --> 00:49:37,080
So, you know, utilizing all
those things outside of you I

821
00:49:37,080 --> 00:49:40,640
think is really, really wise.
It's Sage to me.

822
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:42,800
There you go.
I like that.

823
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:44,080
Find the name right there.
Yes.

824
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:47,920
So we're talking to the Sage.
I'm sure the Sage is that other

825
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:52,560
Sage mentors in the past.
What has been the best advice

826
00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:54,600
that you've received from some
of these mentors?

827
00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:59,760
Oh, so I would say probably the
first, the first, my first

828
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:04,000
mentor was my parents.
You know, which I wanted my

829
00:50:04,000 --> 00:50:07,240
children to feel like I was one
of their first mentors too.

830
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:10,360
You know, as a parent, you want
to be a mentor and you want to

831
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:14,920
be a cheerleader.
And so I feel like my parents

832
00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:19,320
were my first and they were
challenging me to be comfortable

833
00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:22,480
in my own skin.
You know, they were challenging

834
00:50:22,480 --> 00:50:25,560
me like my like I was telling
you guys earlier, my dad said,

835
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:28,960
don't come home from college
without a degree that you can

836
00:50:28,960 --> 00:50:32,720
actually work with.
You know, so don't come home and

837
00:50:32,720 --> 00:50:36,200
plan to live at home and a work
at the Chick-fil-A.

838
00:50:36,200 --> 00:50:38,480
You know you need to come home
and.

839
00:50:38,480 --> 00:50:41,040
Go start your.
Career, start your career, get a

840
00:50:41,040 --> 00:50:44,200
job right.
So that that was some of some of

841
00:50:44,200 --> 00:50:48,400
their advice was some of the
best first advice I got.

842
00:50:48,720 --> 00:50:54,640
Then working in my working
career, I actually had a couple

843
00:50:54,640 --> 00:50:59,680
of really good mentors that came
from my audit clients.

844
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:05,680
So like I got to know the CFO or
the controller at the company

845
00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:09,520
and they actually gave me really
good career advice.

846
00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:14,000
A lot of times they were
interested in investing in me as

847
00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:20,680
a young woman and young, I don't
think it's super common, but I

848
00:51:20,680 --> 00:51:22,440
was really, really thankful for
it.

849
00:51:22,920 --> 00:51:27,960
And then I worked in a really
large organization that had a

850
00:51:28,040 --> 00:51:32,480
women's leadership program
inside of the company.

851
00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:36,240
And I was invited to join that
women women's leadership

852
00:51:36,240 --> 00:51:38,480
program.
And we write, we read books

853
00:51:38,480 --> 00:51:44,080
together, we talked together.
So we, we might not all be older

854
00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:47,400
or farther along in our career,
but we were all having our own

855
00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:50,400
struggles.
And so we would share about them

856
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:52,320
and we would help help each
other with them, you know,

857
00:51:52,320 --> 00:51:56,400
because sometimes your friends
and your spouse can be great

858
00:51:56,400 --> 00:51:59,680
mentors for you.
They know you and they love you

859
00:52:00,120 --> 00:52:03,680
and they can give good input.
They can speak into who and what

860
00:52:03,680 --> 00:52:06,160
you're doing.
Absolutely, and we agree with

861
00:52:06,160 --> 00:52:08,360
both of those things.
I mean, I think we're both so

862
00:52:08,360 --> 00:52:12,080
thankful for how much family and
parents and mentors have poured

863
00:52:12,080 --> 00:52:16,440
into us and it makes.
But Speaking of that, if any

864
00:52:16,440 --> 00:52:20,480
listeners on the podcast want to
connect with you, whether as

865
00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:24,840
small the Center clients or just
as a mentor, I want to hear more

866
00:52:24,840 --> 00:52:27,240
about your story.
What's the best way for people

867
00:52:27,240 --> 00:52:31,120
to reach out to you?
So they can go to my website,

868
00:52:31,160 --> 00:52:36,720
thesageperspective.com and
there's a contact form there.

869
00:52:36,720 --> 00:52:38,320
They can send me an e-mail,
great.

870
00:52:38,400 --> 00:52:41,400
They can direct message me on
LinkedIn.

871
00:52:41,400 --> 00:52:45,160
Like I said, I post a couple of
times a week so and I always

872
00:52:45,160 --> 00:52:50,560
post as myself.
So a lot of times I will tag the

873
00:52:50,560 --> 00:52:54,000
sage perspective sure, but but
they can get me that way too.

874
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:56,880
Those are other really good,
really good ways and I would

875
00:52:56,880 --> 00:53:03,160
love, I love to talk to young,
young engineers, young

876
00:53:03,160 --> 00:53:06,360
accountants, young whatever.
Highly ambitious young

877
00:53:06,360 --> 00:53:09,480
professionals.
Yeah, yes, yes, absolutely.

878
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:13,920
And, and, and new entrepreneurs
like, hey, we got this started

879
00:53:13,960 --> 00:53:17,680
and we, we're trying to figure
it out what, what questions do

880
00:53:17,680 --> 00:53:19,600
we need to be asked?
Perfect person to ask.

881
00:53:19,680 --> 00:53:23,440
She's got a process ironed out
from Step 1 to exiting the

882
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:25,920
business.
That's awesome, Selena.

883
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:27,800
Thank you.
This was so good.

884
00:53:27,800 --> 00:53:28,600
Yeah.
That was awesome.

885
00:53:28,600 --> 00:53:29,640
Thank you so much for joining
us.

886
00:53:29,680 --> 00:53:31,200
Today, Thank you for having me
guys.