Matt Gabriel: Co-Founding a Business in his 30's | EP 39

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What does it really take to walk
away from a predictable path and

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step into the unknown world of
entrepreneurship where your

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success depends on your own grit
and vision?

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Today, I'm excited to welcome
Matt Gabriel, Co founder of Tech

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Wheelhouse.
With a strong background in

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sales, Matt built his career
helping businesses grow before

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taking the leap in his 30s to
launch his own venture.

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Now, as a young entrepreneur,
he's using the same drive and

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insight to help companies
harness technology as a true

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competitive advantage.
In this episode, you'll hear

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Matt's story of shifting from
stale sales to startups, the

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risks and rewards of launching a
business in your 30s, and the

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lessons he's learned about
resilience, strategy, and

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building momentum from scratch.
Matt, thanks so much for

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joining.
Yeah.

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Thanks for having.
Me, yeah.

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So your company I know does a
lot of like is the EAM kind of

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implementations.
Can you give us such a little

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bit of an overview of what y'all
specialize in?

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Yeah, for sure.
So we're services partner, so we

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help companies implement what's
now Hexagon EAM used to be in

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four before that it was Data
Stream.

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So kind of has a deep roots here
in Greenville because data

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stream was a Greenville based
company.

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But so we focus most on helping
our customers implement,

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optimize, integrate, you know
that solution with other systems

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that they.
Is it specifically the N 4 or

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hex whatever N 4?
Yeah, Yep, just Hexagon EAM, you

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know, and I always think back to
how I got into this space.

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You know, I can share a little
bit more later about this, but

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you know, when I met with Marty
Osborne who hired me originally,

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he said that they only worked
with one solution.

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And I kind of asked him, I was
like, is that risky?

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You know?
And you know, he kind of said

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something that we've sort of
adopted, which is that if we if

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we can be the best at that one
thing and and continue to drive

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value for our customers and that
one thing, then who cares if

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it's our only thing.
Yeah, I had a Marty on the

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podcast early on.
We first started and he told me

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the story about when he was
getting about to get on a plane

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and he got word that in for the
this one solution had basically

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like cut him off and said no one
communicate with him.

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Like he's stealing too much
business and it was like a huge

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hurdle he had to get over.
Oh yeah, I've heard that story a

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million times.
It's crazy that is it's risky

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when you do that, but it is.
It can pay dividends as well,

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for sure.
So you're a founding partner

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with the company?
Yep.

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And there's sort of a whole back
story, but, you know, that that

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company that we worked for was
acquired.

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And, you know, when we got over
to the new company, it's a much

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larger organization.
And, you know, a few of us kind

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of just felt like we enjoyed
being part of a smaller group,

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more flexible.
You know, we could help smaller

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customers, especially, you know,
you got local businesses around

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here that use the software.
And so it definitely was an

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opportunity that presented
itself.

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And then my partner, James Crow
and I kind of just leaped on it.

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That's cool.
There's a lot of local

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businesses that use that.
I don't know if I told you I

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worked on that software as an
intern.

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Did you?
Yeah, I was.

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I didn't.
I don't know if any of my stuff

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ever got merged in, but I got to
like familiar with the code base

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and I got to work on it for one
summer.

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That's awesome, I did not know
that.

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Yeah, Becca, Becca N 4.
Wow, yeah.

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Yeah.
So I'm familiar with it.

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I do remember it being it's just
like a massive piece of

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software.
It is.

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You can do so many different
things with it.

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Was there a learning curve like
getting people trained on that?

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100% I mean, it is a very
configurable software, which is

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why I think having services
partners, you know, with

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experience across all industries
is valuable because you know,

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it's kind of like a blank canvas
when you get it.

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And so I do think there was a
learning curve and obviously I'm

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not as much in the software.
I stay more on the sales side

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and I'm kind of doing a lot of
the back office stuff of the

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business.
My partner James is much more

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leading kind of the operations
delivery and and he's a

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developer.
So the technical side, hence the

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name tech wheelhouse.
So that was kind of part of that

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genesis.
But we do have some, you know,

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really experienced people on our
team with like a lot of, you

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know, kind of functional
knowledge and they're really

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involved with helping train kind
of our younger, you know, newer.

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Consultants, how did you and
James meet originally?

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So we met at at Evoca, at the
company that we both worked at

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together.
Yeah.

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And, you know, we've known each
other now for almost 10 years,

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but we didn't really start the
conversation about doing

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something together until about
six months before we launched.

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And.
Six months.

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Wow.
So just so the listeners are

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aware, I've had a lot of
requests for like younger

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entrepreneurs.
So how old were you when you

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took that leap of faith and
started or started a tech Wheel

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Health?
So I was 33.

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As young.
It is.

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In the relative corporate world
when it comes to business

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leaders.
I definitely feel young, like

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even, you know, in our space,
like we know, we know most of

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the other, you know, our
competition in this in the

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space, it's a very small niche
space.

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But even, you know, my dad was
an entrepreneur kind of, he was

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a attorney that started his own
small law firm.

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And so I kind of always was
intrigued by the idea of of

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being a business owner.
And so, yeah, being this young

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was definitely, you know, a
blessing.

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And I, I definitely think that I
have a lot to learn still in my

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journey.
But, you know, it's so fun, kind

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of like, you know, because we
have a lot of young people at

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our company too.
So, you know, being able to

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relate a little bit to like some
of the things that they're

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learning and going through just
because I did that not all that

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long ago, you know?
That's cool.

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So when did becoming a business
owner kind of hop on the plate

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for you per SE?
Well, I guess I always wanted to

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try my hand as an entrepreneur
at some point.

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Had no idea what or when or or
how that was going to come to

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fruition.
So that's kind of always just

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been in the back of your
breathing.

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I want to do this but I'm not
sure how.

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Yeah, I mean, sometimes it just
takes an opportunity.

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And, you know, Marty was a big
he, he had a big role in that

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too, because he he always
challenged me.

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And, you know, I think he knew
that I kind of wanted to go that

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route.
So even when I started working

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for him, he was already exposing
me to, you know, different areas

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that, you know, I felt like
we're valuable in my learning

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process.
And that just kind of helped me

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when it came to the point where
it's like, Hey, I'm at a

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crossroads and I got to I got to
choose like, do I do this or

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not?
I had confidence because I felt

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like I had learned and, you
know, kind of garnered the

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skills that I needed.
And, you know, so far it's

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worked out.
My journey's still very young

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and Ted Wheelhouse is still
really young, so that story is

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not fully written.
But but no, we're we're

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definitely excited and having a
lot of fun doing it.

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Yeah.
So as a Clemson student, you

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kind of did you envision like
maybe leading the business one

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day as a Clemson student or just
kind of I'm going to get my

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degree, just figure it out
later?

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Man, I had such a unique kind of
Clemson experience and

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transition from engineering into
software.

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So it actually kind of goes
back.

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This is a funny story.
When I was a senior in high

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school, I went on spring break,
big group of us went to Cancun,

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Mexico.
A lot of a lot of parents came

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with the chaperones and stuff.
And there was, there was one

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night that, you know, all my
friends had gone to sleep and,

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you know, I, I found myself
hanging out with all the dads

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and they were kind of outside
smoking cigars on the beach or

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something.
And I got to talking to this,

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but it's kind.
Of weird that all the dads are

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staying up later than.
That's true, although we were

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1718 at the time.
So, but yeah, so we I get to

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talking to this one guy and you
know, he's like, where are you

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going to school?
I said, I'm going to Clemson.

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He's like, what are you going to
study?

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I said industrial engineering
and he said, man, we my company,

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we hire industrial engineers all
the time.

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I was like, oh, that's awesome.
So we should keep in touch.

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I said great, thought nothing of
it a year after my freshman, I

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guess it was my summer, my
freshman year, you know, I start

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talking to my parents about
looking for my first internship,

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trying to do all that.
And my mom was like, you need to

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reach out to, you know, so and
so from from that conversation

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you had because I told her about
it and I said, OK, I'll do that.

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So I sent him an e-mail few days
ago by I hadn't heard anything.

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All of a sudden I get a phone
call from an Atlanta area code

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and it's the head of HR for
Manhattan Association.

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And I answered the phone and
she's like, hey, Matt, you know,

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Pete sent me your, your resume.
We'd love to get you in here for

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an interview for an internship.
And I'm like, man, this is

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awesome.
I better start doing some

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research.
Turns out he was the CEO.

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No idea.
He was the CEO of Manhattan.

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So that's how I got into
software had no, you know, I

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mean, you take classes in
development software as an

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engineer, but like I had no,
like at some point in my career

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I want to go that route, but I
really enjoyed that opportunity.

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And So what is Manassas or?
Manhattan Associates, so they do

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supply chain software.
So they're pretty large company

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in Atlanta.
I mean they're publicly traded

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and I think Pete since left and
is the CEO of another software

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company too.
Now I have kept in touch with

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them a little bit, but but it's
just a funny story.

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That's a sweet internship.
Is it your first summer, like

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out of or not even outside of
college?

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Your first summer after
graduating high school or yeah,

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or freshman year?
Sorry, I'm all over the place

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with that.
But that's sweet though.

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So I turned that into a Co-op
and I did 5 Co-op rotations.

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Ended up getting 5 rotations.
I started a summer of my

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freshman year so I did every
summer and I think I did 1

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semester and ended up taking a
full time job there.

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That was my first job after
after Clemson.

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And it's funny because all the
other co-ops and interns being

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in Atlanta were Georgia Tech
guys.

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So I was the only Clemson guy
and I like made it my mission to

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like make sure that people knew
that I wasn't just that guy that

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got the job because heats and
the Skyland CEO recommended me

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like I worked my tail off to
make sure that, you know, people

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understood that you know what
kind of guy I was.

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Good for you.
That's awesome.

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So I guess going back to your
founding journey, you said there

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was a six month kind of planning
or when the idea was planted to

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where the launch took place,
what kind of discussions were

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being had during that time?
Man, I think a lot of it was a

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lot of it was kind of talking
about like a business plan.

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And, you know, everyone has a
different idea of what a

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business plan looks like.
And, you know, my dad drew me

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crazy because his idea of a
business plan was like to a tea

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like this is what you're going
to, you know, stick to.

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And like we were kind of like
flying by the seat of our pants

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a little bit.
Like we had this opportunity,

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you know, there were customers
that were, you know, basically

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being let go and and that was
kind of the first place to

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start.
And it helps that you need the

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customer correct and.
You know, we weren't, you know,

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calling on people, you know,
trying to poach them.

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It was just these customers had
nowhere to go.

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And so, you know, that was kind
of how it started.

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00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:57,920
But then, you know, there's the
conversations, the really

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00:10:57,920 --> 00:11:01,960
serious conversations with your,
you know, spouse, you know, my

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00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:05,160
wife, James's wife, you know,
about like, hey, what's it going

230
00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:08,640
to take to make this work?
What, you know, how long do we

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have, you know, if the the money
doesn't work out and those kind

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of things.
But man, James had this saying

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that, you know, he kept sharing
with me and it was, you know,

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the measure of a man is what it
takes to stop him.

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And it was kind of like a
mentality that we adopted early

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on.
Like during those six months, it

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was just kind of like, you know,
there is no failure.

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Like we're going to figure out
how to make this work.

239
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And that's kind of been our
mentality to this point.

240
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And thankfully we've got a great
team.

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We started with with two people,
me, James and two people.

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And now it's me, James, and we
just hired our 10th employee.

243
00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:48,640
And I think just I appreciate
it.

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00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:54,520
I think that the the team is
what has made it so easy to grow

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00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:57,320
because everyone's hungry.
You know, we have a great

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00:11:57,320 --> 00:11:59,440
camaraderie.
You know, most of us know each

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other from from the past.
And so, yeah, it's, it's been a

248
00:12:03,800 --> 00:12:05,800
pretty easy transition from that
regard that's.

249
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Sweet.
Was there any kind of like back

250
00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:10,480
and forth on we need to invest
or we need to bootstrap or like

251
00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:13,600
how much to try to raise for?
Yeah, like invest, like get

252
00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:15,240
investors, sorry.
No, no.

253
00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:18,280
So it's actually James, I made
the decision early on that we

254
00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:19,680
didn't want to take any outside
money.

255
00:12:19,680 --> 00:12:21,640
We.
Want to we are just like agreed

256
00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:22,560
on that.
You're like we're doing.

257
00:12:22,560 --> 00:12:24,400
It yeah.
And, you know, it wasn't, you

258
00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:30,120
know, I think it, it's kind of a
maybe a measuring stick of how

259
00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:33,520
people view you and, you know,
the opportunity that we had

260
00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:36,920
people that were interested.
But James and I were kind of

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00:12:36,920 --> 00:12:39,320
like, you know, for now, you
know, because the other thing,

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00:12:39,320 --> 00:12:42,240
like I said, was we had on day
one, we had some business.

263
00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:45,360
So it wasn't like we started day
one with no revenue.

264
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We didn't have a lot, you know,
but we started with something

265
00:12:48,120 --> 00:12:50,840
which helped.
Yeah.

266
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And I think that mentality too,
of like growing slowly and

267
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organically has allowed us to
scale the way we have so that,

268
00:12:57,720 --> 00:13:00,760
you know, we're, you know, it'd
be easy to take a big check from

269
00:13:00,760 --> 00:13:01,880
somebody to go hire a bunch of
people.

270
00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:04,600
Then you got to go sell all the
work to keep those people easy.

271
00:13:04,600 --> 00:13:06,320
You got to.
Train You might lose somebody

272
00:13:06,320 --> 00:13:08,000
after you train them.
Exactly.

273
00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:10,000
So we're kind of taking this
approach of like let the

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business dictate the hiring and
you know that kind of thing.

275
00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:17,200
So maybe it's been a little
slower than, you know, some

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people.
Would save it for bootstrapping

277
00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:21,040
a business and already having 10
employees.

278
00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:23,320
That's pretty good.
Yeah, I mean, it is I.

279
00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:26,240
Mean most people stay on their
own for years, you know?

280
00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:29,080
Yeah.
I mean, it's definitely, you

281
00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:32,960
know, I think it's a good thing
that we have grown to where

282
00:13:32,960 --> 00:13:34,960
we're at now.
I do think that we're going to

283
00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:37,360
kind of plateau for a little
while unless, you know,

284
00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:41,200
something really crazy happens.
But I think it's important too,

285
00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:44,040
if you don't grow too fast that
you don't lose your, you know,

286
00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:47,040
community, your culture, you
know, all of those things.

287
00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:51,720
So we have made a a pretty like
good effort to make sure that we

288
00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:54,800
don't grow too quickly.
Yeah, I remember talking to you.

289
00:13:54,800 --> 00:13:57,520
It might have been the week of
or the month of when you started

290
00:13:57,520 --> 00:14:00,880
Tech Wheelhouse, but what was
day one like when you're like,

291
00:14:00,880 --> 00:14:03,880
alright, we're official.
We just filed the paperwork.

292
00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:06,320
We just opened our check your
bank account or whatever.

293
00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:11,800
Oh man, day one was so actually
James and I went to, we went to

294
00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:15,280
the mountains for three days,
for like the first three days

295
00:14:15,880 --> 00:14:17,280
because I mean, we're just
sitting in front of our

296
00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:19,240
computer.
We brought printer copier

297
00:14:19,240 --> 00:14:21,000
scanner.
You know, we're like literally

298
00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:23,760
like, you know, sending out
these invoices.

299
00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:26,800
You know, we're, we're doing all
these kickoffs.

300
00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:30,200
We're we're trying to like kind
of keep our, our heads on, if

301
00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:33,520
you will, but it was really, it
was really hectic.

302
00:14:33,520 --> 00:14:36,680
But you know, at the same time,
I think it went, it went well.

303
00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:39,360
And like I said, we had two
people with us that were, you

304
00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:42,080
know, working and so day one was
hectic.

305
00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:45,640
But but then again, here we are
a year and a half in and it's

306
00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:49,080
still kind of hectic, so.
Looking back on your journey,

307
00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:51,440
what would you say the things
are like, hey, we did this

308
00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:53,680
really well, and then what are
the things you're like, hey, we

309
00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:57,000
could have done this better?
That's a really good question.

310
00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:01,160
I think I, I said a little bit
about, you know, how we've

311
00:15:01,160 --> 00:15:03,360
scaled.
I'm proud of like not doing it

312
00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:06,880
too quickly.
I think, you know, if James and

313
00:15:06,880 --> 00:15:08,960
I are very different
individuals, which I think is

314
00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:13,960
great for our partnership.
Like absolutely, he's much more

315
00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:17,680
of, you know, the technical guy
and you know he's in I don't

316
00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:19,800
know if you know about the
working genius and and all.

317
00:15:19,800 --> 00:15:21,880
Yes.
Is that the same thing as the

318
00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:23,840
disc?
It's not the same thing.

319
00:15:23,840 --> 00:15:26,040
It's it's similar.
It's more about like, you know,

320
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:28,720
your, your work, like what gives
you energy?

321
00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:31,240
What type of assignments give
you energy?

322
00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:33,760
It's good.
Which types frustrate you?

323
00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:37,400
So like we're yin and Yang,
which is perfect because like,

324
00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:41,520
you know, I can help discern and
I'm a galvanizer because I'm a

325
00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:43,080
sales guy.
So that's part of the working

326
00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:44,960
genius.
And then he's much more of an

327
00:15:44,960 --> 00:15:47,920
inventor.
And the tenacity of doing

328
00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:49,600
actually seeing it to
completion.

329
00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:51,440
Kind of building.
Things, yeah, for sure.

330
00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:55,320
So I think if you ask him, you
know, he was very much on like

331
00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:57,960
we got to make sure the systems
and processes are in place to

332
00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:01,200
allow us for for scaling, which
I think was huge because he

333
00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:03,240
could have just day one been
like, all right, let's just do

334
00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:04,960
this do that.
And you know he was.

335
00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:09,040
Like nice, that's really good.
So I definitely think that would

336
00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:11,400
be something something that we
did really well looking back on.

337
00:16:11,400 --> 00:16:13,800
And I mean, obviously there's
room for improvement, all of

338
00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,240
that things that we could have
done better.

339
00:16:17,320 --> 00:16:22,520
You know, I still think that
we're we're learning, you know,

340
00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:25,400
how to run a business.
So like we're learning about the

341
00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:31,000
back end stuff with accounting
and, you know, contracts and,

342
00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:33,600
and all that stuff has
definitely been something that

343
00:16:34,040 --> 00:16:36,960
it was easier when you're at a
company, a larger company that

344
00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:38,920
has teams and people to do that
stuff.

345
00:16:39,120 --> 00:16:42,200
So, you know, we're kind of all
wearing a lot of hats, you know,

346
00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:44,880
doing this kind of stuff.
So I, I do think there was maybe

347
00:16:45,040 --> 00:16:48,280
an opportunity to have done some
of like the initial accounting

348
00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:51,920
setup differently and things
like that, but but really proud

349
00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:54,240
of, of where we're at.
Can you walk us through a

350
00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:57,880
typical day today as a partner
at Tech Wheelhouse?

351
00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:01,840
Well, I think it changes so much
because I because we're so young

352
00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:04,440
and we do wear so many hats.
You know, like I said, James

353
00:17:04,440 --> 00:17:06,560
kind of more on like the
delivery side.

354
00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:10,760
You know, he's kind of having
one on ones with with the team

355
00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:12,000
members.
What do they need?

356
00:17:12,000 --> 00:17:14,079
Do they feel supported?
Do they, you know, have what

357
00:17:14,079 --> 00:17:18,240
they need to be successful?
I'm doing a lot more of the less

358
00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:21,880
fun things like HR, you know,
setting people up in our, you

359
00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:26,319
know, PEO system, doing payroll,
QuickBooks, you know, but at the

360
00:17:26,319 --> 00:17:32,160
same time, I my #1 you know, I
guess a value add to, to the

361
00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:34,600
company is I'm, I'm our only
salesperson.

362
00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:38,040
So like if I'm spending more
time doing that stuff, then I'm

363
00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:40,920
not spending as much time as I
could be selling.

364
00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:44,320
So as we grow, I mean those are
the the first areas that you

365
00:17:44,320 --> 00:17:48,320
know, we'll hire support folks
for hopefully when the time is

366
00:17:48,320 --> 00:17:50,720
right.
So we live in a very like

367
00:17:50,720 --> 00:17:53,920
dynamic business atmosphere,
especially with AI, like

368
00:17:53,920 --> 00:17:55,840
everyone's trying to like, how
can we use AI?

369
00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:59,600
And with you, I mean, with y'all
implementing the software, if

370
00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:02,200
they roll an update that's
massive, you ought to be able to

371
00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:04,800
adjust to that quickly.
You know, your customers are

372
00:18:04,800 --> 00:18:06,760
going to be wondering like, hey,
what does this mean?

373
00:18:06,760 --> 00:18:09,440
How can we adjust to this?
How do you stay up to date with

374
00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:11,640
the changes within your
industry?

375
00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:15,600
One thing I think as a partner
of the software vendor where

376
00:18:15,600 --> 00:18:19,560
serves as partner we you know,
can see the road map and kind of

377
00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:22,600
like understand what's coming,
like what new features are being

378
00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:24,320
released.
So they share that with you.

379
00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:27,520
Yeah.
And so, you know, we might not

380
00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:31,200
have access to all of this.
You're on a good page with the

381
00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:32,800
developers.
Oh yeah, yeah.

382
00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:35,400
Unlike unlike when they were
cutting off Marty earlier well.

383
00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:38,800
Let's see, Marty was that was a
long time ago by the time Marty

384
00:18:38,800 --> 00:18:41,280
sold his business.
I mean, he was like the premier

385
00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:44,840
partner, you know, so they were
back on great terms.

386
00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:47,880
And you know, I think, you know,
having a good relationship with

387
00:18:47,880 --> 00:18:51,760
them is, is massive because you
know, it's it's their customer

388
00:18:51,760 --> 00:18:54,760
foundation, their product.
We're just here to help make

389
00:18:54,760 --> 00:18:58,120
them successful using that.
So being on the same page, I

390
00:18:58,120 --> 00:19:00,560
think is really important.
The back to your question about

391
00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:03,800
like, you know, cutting edge
trends and you know, new

392
00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:07,160
features and that kind of stuff,
I mean, it's a, it's a crazy

393
00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:10,000
changing environment out there.
I feel like we're trying to

394
00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:15,000
adapt to like, you know, we're
investing heavily and developing

395
00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:18,400
some of our own tool sets and
solutions that can bolt on and

396
00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:21,480
and really help drive more value
our customers.

397
00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:25,520
So we're trying to get involved
with some of that stuff too, but

398
00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:28,120
ultimately it's really just
understanding what the what the

399
00:19:28,120 --> 00:19:30,640
client needs, what they're
trying to accomplish, and with

400
00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:32,160
what tools can we help them do
that.

401
00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:34,640
Nice, That's awesome.
I guess going back to like the

402
00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:38,160
origins of being a founder of
business and you think back on

403
00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:41,040
the first couple days, first
couple weeks, what are the most

404
00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:43,560
important things that you can't
miss when you're starting that

405
00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:45,960
business?
Is it we have to spend a lot on

406
00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:48,440
advertising and marketing?
Is that we have to make sure

407
00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:51,560
that our, I guess the foundation
was a big thing for all your

408
00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:53,640
work processes they said James
worked on?

409
00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:56,280
Was it making sure all the
accounting and the finances in

410
00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:57,560
order?
I'm sure finance is a huge

411
00:19:57,560 --> 00:19:59,920
thing, senior projections, but
like what were the things y'all

412
00:19:59,920 --> 00:20:03,560
really prioritized during that
first week or two or month?

413
00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:07,480
I like to say that I think you
know, the most important thing

414
00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:11,840
to prioritize is your people
making sure that you know,

415
00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:18,440
ultimately they are at least in
the services world that that's

416
00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:21,440
like your company, like that's
those are the face.

417
00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:23,360
They're the people that are
talking to the customers that

418
00:20:23,360 --> 00:20:26,080
are delivering work.
So like making sure that they

419
00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:30,320
feel supported and that they are
have the same, but they're all

420
00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:32,600
on the same page as far as
messaging about what the

421
00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:35,800
businesses priorities, values
that kind of stuff are.

422
00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:40,800
I would say that, you know,
developing that sort of core

423
00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:44,200
group of people that you know,
are there at the beginning was

424
00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:46,680
was a priority for us.
And then, like you said,

425
00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:49,000
scalability.
What what things do you have to

426
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:50,920
put in place to make sure that
you can scale?

427
00:20:50,920 --> 00:20:53,040
Like I already talked about,
that was important.

428
00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:56,720
And then, you know, the reality
of a business is the number one

429
00:20:56,720 --> 00:20:59,000
thing you need is revenue.
So you got to go out and find

430
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:02,200
customers.
You know, there's a book called

431
00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:04,880
the Infinite Game, and it's all
about, you know, instead of

432
00:21:04,880 --> 00:21:08,160
selling that one deal that, you
know, it could be the biggest

433
00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:10,080
deal of your customer, your
company's history.

434
00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:13,080
But like at the end of that
deal, if you and that customer

435
00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:16,080
say goodbye, it's not as
valuable as developing that

436
00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:19,240
infinite relationship.
Like, hey, it might only be that

437
00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:22,880
you need a $5000 PO to start.
How can we help you?

438
00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:25,280
And if we drove value and they
asked for more, well, we're

439
00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:26,920
going to continue that
relationship.

440
00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:30,400
So it's about loyalty Long.
Term long term relationships.

441
00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:33,280
I've heard it said that a lot of
successful people, they're

442
00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:35,560
thinking like decades, they're
thinking long term.

443
00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:37,920
They're not thinking like how
can I and grow a business this

444
00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:39,200
year?
How can I make a bunch of money

445
00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:40,280
this year?
It's correct.

446
00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:43,240
It's how can I make a bunch of
money 10 years from now kind of

447
00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:45,560
in that long term mindset.
Absolutely.

448
00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:48,560
So how did you find such?
Good quality people for your

449
00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:52,920
first hires.
Well, I think there were people

450
00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:56,840
that after the acquisition that
were that were looking to leave.

451
00:21:56,880 --> 00:22:02,000
And so that was a good fertile
people that we knew, we knew

452
00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:04,960
their skill set.
But I think more importantly,

453
00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:09,320
the long term strategy there is,
is finding the right kind of

454
00:22:09,320 --> 00:22:13,960
clay young, humble, hungry,
driven people.

455
00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:16,880
We're we're doing the Co-op
program at Clemson.

456
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:20,800
So getting some, some, you know,
of these engineers and, and

457
00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:24,240
computer science majors want to
get involved.

458
00:22:27,360 --> 00:22:28,880
We just finished our first
rotation.

459
00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:32,240
We had two computer science
majors and you know, they're,

460
00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:35,360
they're so smart, they're so
hungry and they they've been a

461
00:22:35,360 --> 00:22:37,240
great culture.
But I think we hit home runs

462
00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:39,840
with the first two that we did.
But back to your question is

463
00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:43,320
those are the type of people if
we can develop a training

464
00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:48,120
program, get the right people in
that fit our culture that you

465
00:22:48,120 --> 00:22:51,280
know we see potential for and
then training them up and

466
00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:54,440
hopefully help them grow.
So you're smaller company,

467
00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:57,360
obviously you said 10 employees,
so maybe don't answer this

468
00:22:57,360 --> 00:22:59,640
question for your company
specifically, but maybe some

469
00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:02,760
previous organizations you've
had a long careers or decent

470
00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:03,960
careers so far.
We're not old.

471
00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:07,080
But people that like aren't
fitting the culture.

472
00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:09,720
Like one day you might hire
somebody that's just not fitting

473
00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:12,080
the culture.
Like how do you teach that?

474
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:14,400
How do you train that?
What would how would you coach

475
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:16,200
that person?
That's a good question.

476
00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:18,360
Thankfully, we haven't had to
deal with that quite yet.

477
00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:21,000
I really think that everyone on
our team has, you know, bought

478
00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:24,320
into kind of the the culture.
But, you know, I think culture

479
00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:26,240
is really important.
You have to protect the culture,

480
00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:28,640
you know, can all go out the
window.

481
00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:33,360
So, you know, I think did you
make the right decision during

482
00:23:33,360 --> 00:23:35,160
the hiring process?
That's a big thing.

483
00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:39,640
So we we have a very detailed
hiring process to try to really

484
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:43,400
like weed out, you know, are we
finding the right people, the

485
00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:46,840
right personalities, the right
working genius, But also do they

486
00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:48,360
fit the culture?
Are they someone that we could

487
00:23:48,360 --> 00:23:50,360
all hang out with?
Do we, you know, are they

488
00:23:50,360 --> 00:23:52,640
someone that we can put in front
of our biggest customer and make

489
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:55,160
a good impression?
You know, things like that.

490
00:23:55,880 --> 00:24:00,120
So I, I would say maybe the best
way to handle it is to prevent

491
00:24:00,120 --> 00:24:01,840
it, you know, during the hiring
process.

492
00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:03,320
What is yours hiring process
like?

493
00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:08,000
How long does it take?
So I would say it varies, but

494
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,640
basically we have a number of
interviews and this is an

495
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:12,840
evolving process because we're
still young, but we have

496
00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:16,880
prioritized and making sure that
a candidate is interviewed by a

497
00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:20,400
lot of people within our group.
So it's not just like a decision

498
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:24,880
in a silo, like everyone can get
a feel for are they going to fit

499
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:27,840
in?
We do make them do the working

500
00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:31,240
genius and the disk profile
tests ahead of time, which I

501
00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:35,160
think is critical.
Like, you know, you could have a

502
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:37,680
role that you're hiring for.
Like, for example, if I was

503
00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:41,560
hiring for a salesperson and
that person's frustrated by

504
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:45,360
galvanizing, that's probably not
the right person for sales.

505
00:24:45,360 --> 00:24:47,160
You know, you want someone that
that wants to be out there

506
00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:49,840
selling their ideas, getting
people bought into it.

507
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:51,480
So like that's really important
for us.

508
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:54,040
Same thing if if you have
someone that's going to be doing

509
00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:59,560
a lot of kind of data entry and
you know, analytics and if they

510
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:02,480
have a frustration and tenacity
and the actual completion of

511
00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:05,800
tasks like that's probably not a
great fit either because they're

512
00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:07,840
going to get frustrated in that
environment.

513
00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:10,560
So y'all I guess put them
through these like personality

514
00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:13,280
assessments?
Yep, before we ever before.

515
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:15,360
You interview them, so you've
already like had them take this

516
00:25:15,360 --> 00:25:16,960
test.
You've already studied up on it

517
00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:18,840
and have an idea of like, hey,
they fit well here.

518
00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:21,040
They wouldn't fit.
And it's also cool to ask them

519
00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:22,120
what they think about the
results.

520
00:25:22,120 --> 00:25:25,000
So you can learn a lot about
somebody if like, if they, you

521
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:27,240
know, look like a deer in the
headlights, they probably didn't

522
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:29,320
read the the results.
Like that's not a good sign.

523
00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:31,600
But you know, a lot of times
we'll have kids that are like,

524
00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:33,400
man, I really didn't agree with
this.

525
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:34,880
Like, I thought I was more like
this.

526
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:36,760
And, you know, sometimes you
learn a little bit about

527
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:38,040
yourself taking that stuff.
Too.

528
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:40,280
That's a good point.
I guess they could kind of be

529
00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:43,160
shocked by that and then get
into the job or the day-to-day

530
00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:44,920
and realize, oh I actually don't
enjoy this.

531
00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:48,160
Exactly.
I'm doing my MBA program at UNC.

532
00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:51,160
They offer career coaches there.
I just reached out to career

533
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:52,720
coach and was like, hey, what
are the first steps here?

534
00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:54,840
Well, how can I, I don't know,
get involved in this process?

535
00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:56,800
And she had me take some of
these personality assessments

536
00:25:57,080 --> 00:26:00,640
and it returned back like some
potential jobs that you might be

537
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:02,560
interested in and some that you
wouldn't be a fit in.

538
00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:04,360
And some of the ones at the
bottom, I was like, that's what

539
00:26:04,360 --> 00:26:08,240
I like really saw myself do and
it's rated me at like a 60.

540
00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:10,040
And then some of these other
ones it's like rating high.

541
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,240
I'm like, where does like I
never thought that.

542
00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:14,600
And I think the most important
thing about some of that stuff

543
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:18,360
is, you know, it's, it's not the
gospel like, you know, like we

544
00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:19,760
can.
Be wrong.

545
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:23,240
There are certain things about
it that I feel like hit more

546
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,680
than they miss.
But at the, at the same time,

547
00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:29,480
the other thing is like, and you
know, somebody in, in my past

548
00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,800
told me about this, but if
you're, if you think about your

549
00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:35,320
company as a bus, there's open
seats on the bus.

550
00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:38,480
You know, if you find someone
that you really think fits your

551
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:42,000
company, but you just don't know
what seat they need to get in,

552
00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:46,160
like get them on the bus 1st and
then you can find a seat for

553
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:47,520
them.
I mean, that's essentially how

554
00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:50,480
Marty hired me.
So I turned Marty down.

555
00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:52,560
He was trying, he was looking
for IES, looking for

556
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:55,080
consultants.
I was at Manhattan Associates, I

557
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:58,280
was a consultant and I really
wanted to get into sales.

558
00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:00,880
And he called me and said I want
you to come be a consultant.

559
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:03,960
And I said I really, I'm not
interested in doing the same

560
00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:05,600
thing.
It feels like a lateral move,

561
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:07,600
like this is what I really want
to do.

562
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:11,080
And he said I can probably make
a position for that, Give me an

563
00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:14,360
entry level sales shop.
I have no sales experience.

564
00:27:14,360 --> 00:27:17,040
And you know, ever since then,
sales has become kind of my

565
00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:18,800
passion.
Have you always done sales since

566
00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:20,600
then, I guess since then, Yeah,
Nice.

567
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:22,960
What is the biggest key to
sales?

568
00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:26,240
That's kind of a broad question,
but I guess, well, what's your

569
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,400
mindset going into trying to
find a new customer?

570
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:33,680
Well, so I guess depends on
which part of the sales process

571
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:35,000
you're talking about.
If you're looking at kind of

572
00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:39,400
like the, you know, initial like
finding prospects, you got to

573
00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:40,720
have someone that's willing to
grind.

574
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:43,240
You know, like that's How I Met
your wife.

575
00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:48,040
She was like a magician because
she could just connect with

576
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:50,200
people on the phone.
She could connect with people

577
00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:52,360
and like that's important.
You got to be able to establish

578
00:27:52,360 --> 00:27:55,920
rapport quickly once you.
Go with the little hooker that

579
00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:57,400
you you made her practice and
do.

580
00:27:57,640 --> 00:28:00,960
Oh, the the script, gosh, that
was a long time ago.

581
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,480
But you know, again, you can go
off script if you're confident,

582
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:06,000
you understand how to talk to
people.

583
00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:09,400
And I think that just comes with
with a level of confidence and

584
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:12,480
experience.
But I think the most important

585
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:15,000
thing with sales is just be able
to listen and build

586
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:18,320
relationships.
I mean, you know, don't go in

587
00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:22,640
there trying to to cram product
or offerings or services down

588
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:24,840
someones throat.
Like listen to what they say.

589
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:28,440
Sometimes, you know, people can
make a dumb comment and they're

590
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:31,120
like, man, I like, I just hate
that this software doesn't do

591
00:28:31,120 --> 00:28:32,960
that.
And it's like, wait a second,

592
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,080
like I heard you that we can
make it do that.

593
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:37,880
And like, would that be
interesting if I showed you how

594
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:41,280
we could potentially do that?
And so that's kind of one thing.

595
00:28:41,280 --> 00:28:43,440
Has anyone?
Ever been rude back to you?

596
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,760
Oh, yeah, yeah.
There was a guy that actually

597
00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:48,880
worked with me and Christina.
His name's Johnny Bofillia.

598
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:52,600
So he had this, he had this
great line about that.

599
00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:55,720
And it was, you know, you get
someone that's rude to you, so

600
00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:57,560
eat a Tic Tac.
He said just forget about it.

601
00:28:57,720 --> 00:28:59,880
So you keep a little box of Tic
Tacs on his desk.

602
00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:02,840
But like, someone was rude to
you, eat a Tic Tac, move on.

603
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:06,320
You know, totally.
Because at the end of the day,

604
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:08,320
like those people might just be
having a bad day.

605
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:10,920
You know, they might not be.
You got them at the wrong time

606
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:13,840
and like you can't take it
personal and sales.

607
00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:17,280
I've heard a story from my
brother.

608
00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:19,040
He won't mind me sharing this,
but he was just giving his

609
00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:21,440
normal pitch and someone just,
like, giving the rudest response

610
00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:22,760
back.
And he told me the story and

611
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:25,160
he's like, no one's ever been
that rude.

612
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:27,000
Like, he'll get some kind of
like, I'm not interested.

613
00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:29,480
And it's just like, why do
people treat you like that?

614
00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:30,840
I don't know.
So you got to learn not to take

615
00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:31,680
it personally.
No.

616
00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:33,000
Yeah.
Just move on.

617
00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:35,320
Is that often like, do you get
that a lot or?

618
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:37,760
No, but it's.
Not like rare though at the same

619
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:39,640
time.
Hey, it happens too.

620
00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:42,560
No matter what stage you get me,
you can catch even at the stage

621
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:45,280
that we're at now, like, you
know, you could be talking to

622
00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:49,600
somebody and the see the CIO
gets on there and is frustrated

623
00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:51,880
that they don't think that they
should be paying for this or

624
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:54,080
this.
And you know, like acting rude

625
00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:55,400
and whatever.
It's like at the end of the day,

626
00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,160
you kind of just have to shake
it off and you tic tac.

627
00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:00,240
That's right.
And I tell my wife that too.

628
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:04,480
So Lily is she was a teacher and
she's moved into a career in

629
00:30:04,480 --> 00:30:07,640
sales now and she sells office
technology.

630
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:10,760
And I tell her all the time,
like, you know, what what she's

631
00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:14,560
doing is, is like the best
experience you could possibly

632
00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:16,960
have because she's going
physically door to door to

633
00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:19,280
businesses.
And like you talk about, it's

634
00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:21,120
one thing to get a rude response
over the phone.

635
00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:22,840
It's the other one to get a rude
response.

636
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:25,320
I'm sure it's less likely to
happen to your face, but when it

637
00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:28,240
happens, it stinks.
I think it still happens and

638
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:31,000
again, it's just kind of part
of, you know, that role.

639
00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:33,520
But as soon as you can get past
that, sort of like it's not

640
00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:36,760
personal, like, you know, then
see the Tic Tac.

641
00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:38,440
Yeah.
So how do you handle it when a

642
00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:41,680
maybe a customer is having an
issue with maybe the

643
00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:44,840
implementation or an issue with
software and it's not even your

644
00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:46,720
fault if the software is
misbehaving, that's not your

645
00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:49,000
fault per se.
How do you handle these kind of

646
00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:53,280
angry customers?
I think first and foremost is

647
00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:57,320
like, like, get after trying to
figure out what the problem is

648
00:30:57,320 --> 00:30:59,960
and like, you know, if it's
something that we did, we'll

649
00:30:59,960 --> 00:31:01,680
take care of it.
It's not, we're not going to

650
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:03,800
charge it for that.
If it, if it was a mistake that

651
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:07,000
we made, you know, like I said,
we're really close with the with

652
00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:09,880
the software vendor and so we
work with their support team.

653
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:15,080
And so like we actually have
like a way to liaison between

654
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,600
the company and the software
vendor.

655
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:20,920
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
And sometimes we do find bugs

656
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:23,280
and we're the ones that report
them to the software company.

657
00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:26,440
So it happens to them.
Yeah, someone did do some good

658
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:28,520
Q&A testing.
You know, that's right.

659
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:31,520
And especially when you start
talking about integrations like

660
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:34,160
making, you know systems talk
and things start breaking.

661
00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:37,080
Working maybe potentially with
their home environment, like

662
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:38,880
when you're integrating with
someone else's like

663
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:40,480
infrastructure, that can be
pretty challenging.

664
00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:42,520
Absolutely.
A lot of moving parts there, a

665
00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:45,680
lot of a lot of players at the
table, if you will, because you

666
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:48,480
got the people from the other
side, you got people from the

667
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:51,320
the business, you got our team.
And you're trying to communicate

668
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:53,520
where the problem is.
And there's definitely an

669
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:55,440
element of, you know, challenge
with that.

670
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,360
But I think to answer your
question, like first and

671
00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:00,480
foremost, priority is what is
the problem?

672
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:02,920
How can we fix it?
You know, not let's worry about

673
00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:05,600
whose fault it is later.
Like if it's a mission critical

674
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:07,440
thing, like take care of it.
Nice.

675
00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:10,720
Did you ever consider doing like
Y Combinator or one of those

676
00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:13,440
like startup kind of launch
programs?

677
00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:17,320
No, not really.
And like I said, I think from

678
00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:20,000
the beginning, you know, we kind
of had this like mentality,

679
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:23,280
like, let's, let's do this, you
and I, me and James and, you

680
00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:25,840
know, yeah.
They would require like equity

681
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:27,680
back a lot of those.
Yeah, for sure.

682
00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:31,240
And I mean there are other, you
know, grants and things like

683
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:34,840
local business grants.
You know, we haven't had the

684
00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:38,840
need to do that.
I'd rather that go to a business

685
00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:40,960
that maybe does need it to
survive.

686
00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,240
So yeah, we hadn't.
We haven't gone down that.

687
00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:48,640
As a a salesman or salesman,
sorry, have you ever had like

688
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:53,000
imposter syndrome?
About being in sales or about

689
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:54,800
being in what?
About the kind of product you're

690
00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:57,240
selling.
No, not about the product.

691
00:32:57,240 --> 00:33:00,680
I think we, I think we, we see
the value like I mean, we

692
00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:02,120
wouldn't, we would.
You're confident in.

693
00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:04,200
It yeah, we we live and breathe
this product.

694
00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,480
So like, if we didn't have a
faith in it, we, we wouldn't be

695
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,480
in business, you know.
So I think for sure that, I

696
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:14,440
mean, maybe at the beginning of
my sales journey, when I first

697
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:17,440
started working with Marty, you
know, I had a little bit of

698
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:19,600
like, you know, because I was
new, I'd never done it before,

699
00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:23,240
but I always knew that I could
do it.

700
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:25,520
It was just a matter of time,
right opportunity.

701
00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:30,400
And, you know, he gave me a
sandbox to to play in like my

702
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:32,840
own little, you know, niche
territory.

703
00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:34,680
And I learned a lot through
that.

704
00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:38,080
And so that kind of helped me
overcome that imposter syndrome.

705
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:40,520
And then, you know, starting a
business at 33.

706
00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:43,720
Like they were definitely, you
know, moments of I wouldn't say

707
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:46,520
self doubt, but just like, did I
make the right decision, you

708
00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:49,960
know, walking away from, you
know, a decent paying sales job

709
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:53,400
and taking this risk at this
point in our life, you know, I

710
00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:56,520
joke, you know, we had my we had
my son the same year that we

711
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,400
started.
So I did, I did all the big life

712
00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:02,480
things in one year.
And I, I sometimes wonder like

713
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:08,159
if if I'd had Reeves before,
like what I've done it, you

714
00:34:08,159 --> 00:34:10,360
know, everything works out the
way it's supposed to, so I

715
00:34:10,639 --> 00:34:12,320
would.
Probably be wondering the same

716
00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:14,520
thing.
Yeah, pretty sure I forget that

717
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:16,880
you had a.
Baby, during that time too, how

718
00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:22,000
much sleep were you getting?
Man, those first you know, 10-12

719
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:23,560
weeks were rough but.
Again.

720
00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:28,159
Tip tip of the cap to James and
the rest of the team because I

721
00:34:28,159 --> 00:34:30,800
mean, they, you know, they made
sure that, you know, we didn't

722
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:34,239
skip a beat and and I was still
working, you know, during that

723
00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:35,600
time.
It wasn't like I took a big

724
00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:39,440
paternity leave, but definitely
was an adjustment.

725
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:42,960
So a lot of successful business
leaders will tell you it's more

726
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:45,639
about consistency than just
having like an A+ day.

727
00:34:45,639 --> 00:34:49,080
It's like you went and killed it
today and you made a huge sale.

728
00:34:49,199 --> 00:34:50,600
Great.
Now do it again tomorrow.

729
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:53,920
Now do it again the next day.
What are some daily habits that

730
00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:57,560
you maintain to keep yourself
consistently successful or

731
00:34:57,560 --> 00:35:00,680
consistently on the grind?
That's a good question.

732
00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:02,640
Yeah.
I will say one thing about

733
00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:07,480
having a a young son is that,
like my day is very structured

734
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,480
because like, I wake up every
day and, you know, get his stuff

735
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:12,280
ready before I send them off to
daycare.

736
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:13,840
And at the end of the day, it's
the same thing.

737
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:16,160
It's the same routine.
So like, you know, having that

738
00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:18,760
structure helps you kind of
prioritize and organize your

739
00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:23,760
thoughts for the day.
So you know, one nice thing

740
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:26,800
about the way we've divided up
our responsibilities between me

741
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:30,360
and James too, is that like with
him kind of focusing more on

742
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:33,040
like success for our customers
and the delivery and the, you

743
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:35,840
know, the one on ones with our
team, it kind of leaves my day

744
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:38,800
to be focused more on, you know,
all the other stuff, the back

745
00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:41,280
office stuff, sales.
So like I kind of just go

746
00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:43,840
through the same habits of like,
let me do the busy work first

747
00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:46,080
thing in the morning, get it out
of the way if I need to do stuff

748
00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:49,560
in QuickBooks or, or whatever.
And then, you know, I kind of

749
00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:52,480
shift my gears towards like what
opportunities are open where we

750
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:56,240
chase and like where where each
one of those conversations at.

751
00:35:56,760 --> 00:36:00,240
And then I'll usually leave my
afternoons open for the.

752
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:05,800
Doorbell, so delivery I guess.
I usually leave my afternoons

753
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:10,760
open more for, you know, kind of
like customer conversations,

754
00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:13,520
like if, hey, I need to schedule
a meeting here, we need to do a

755
00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:16,640
demo, you know, try to do that.
But the biggest thing about

756
00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:19,200
being a small business is
flexibility, so my day can go

757
00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:22,200
upside down in a hurry, you
know, if it if it needs.

758
00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:25,640
To What's the best piece of
career advice you've received

759
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:28,200
and how's it helped you lead
Tech Wheelhouse?

760
00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:31,960
If you're going to take a risk,
do it while you're young.

761
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:33,800
I think I'm a living example of
that.

762
00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:40,000
That piece of advice I've kind
of, you know, kind of kept as

763
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:44,120
sort of inspiration because it's
really easy, especially like as

764
00:36:44,120 --> 00:36:46,680
you get older and as you build
your family and as you get more

765
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:50,040
comfortable with, you know,
making more money and, and

766
00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:52,800
moving up in your career, like
it starts to get harder to think

767
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:55,240
about taking a step back and
taking a risk.

768
00:36:55,240 --> 00:36:58,720
So, you know, I felt like the
timing was right for that.

769
00:37:00,360 --> 00:37:05,040
But outside of that, I mean
first and last out mentality,

770
00:37:05,120 --> 00:37:07,840
trying to work harder than your
competition.

771
00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:11,040
Like all of those things, they
sound cliche, but I think they

772
00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:13,800
really ring true when you're
trying to bootstrap.

773
00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:15,720
Nice.
Well, we'll wrap it up here

774
00:37:15,720 --> 00:37:17,920
shortly, but some closing
questions.

775
00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:21,320
When you are done with Tech
Wheelhouse, whenever that day

776
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:23,760
comes and you're you're
obviously going to leave a

777
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:27,000
legacy behind, whether it's you
were leaving on an exit or

778
00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:30,480
whatever it might be, what's the
legacy you hope to leave and and

779
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:33,360
maybe the example that you would
set for Reeves one day with with

780
00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:35,800
leading a business.
Phenomenal question.

781
00:37:37,040 --> 00:37:39,720
Yeah, I mean, everybody always
thinks about like legacy and how

782
00:37:39,720 --> 00:37:41,880
they want to get remembered,
especially as you start getting

783
00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:45,760
older, you know, like that kind
of becomes more of a a thought

784
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:49,360
that comes across your mind.
I would say, you know, more

785
00:37:49,360 --> 00:37:55,760
important than a successful
business or you know, anything

786
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:58,720
I'm on sort of like material or
things like that.

787
00:37:58,720 --> 00:38:03,640
I would want people to say that
Tech Wheelhouse took care of its

788
00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:05,320
people and took care of its
customers.

789
00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:09,120
So I feel like if those two
things were done, then the rest

790
00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:10,880
will take care of itself kind of
thing.

791
00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:14,920
So I would say that for sure it
would be my my hope for legacy.

792
00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:17,880
That's pretty great.
You have a very good people

793
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:19,400
focused approach with
everything.

794
00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:21,920
So I have, I have no doubt
that's going to lead to some

795
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:24,600
good success along the way.
Well, Matt, yeah, thanks so much

796
00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:25,440
for joining me.
That was a lot.

797
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:27,520
That was a fun conversation.
That was a fun conversation,

798
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:28,360
thanks for having me.